When you say "the condition in question" do you mean homophobia or being gay? Gay people have always been around, so there must be some natural or genetic based reason for it, so your supposition is a little thin. Not all bees are born to mate with the Queen.
Frank Castle - 12 years ago
Hello Group, My name is Frank and I suffer from homophobia. I feel that the condition in question is a genetic abnormality and that thanks to Darwinism, such genetics can not be passed along. As a Union Electrician once told me "Rubbing two lamp plugs together or rubbing two outlets together don't turn on the lights". Seems like a reasonable synopsis.
What do you all think? IMHO: Frank.
Martin Pal - 14 years ago
Dear Don, what we have from commenters like you and from many of the posters who answer these articles is fallacy, ignorance, prejudice, preconceived notions, opinions devoid of data, assertions which contradict actual facts, and just plain irrational hatred and bigotry. Yes, Don, you ARE homophobic. You demonstrated it with your post. My lifestyle is probably as boring as yours is so, to quote you, "don't start with that crap." The reason you don't want to acknowledge being gay is a choice is because then you would have to look at gay people differently and if you had to do that you might find that you are the one believing selfish memes and "your" beliefs have been sick. I notice all your "anger" is directed at gay men, judging from your use of the slur "fags." When is it acceptable to use racial, ethnic or sexist slurs, even behind the privacy of your keyboard? It is not. So thanks for not only showing that you are a homophobe, but a perverted example of selfish humanity as well.
don r. - 14 years ago
Martin Pal, I believe everyone should have civil rights....but I also believe that individuals who make the choice to be a homo(which is ALL homos)should NOT get civil rights BECAUSE of their choice. Don't even start with the crap about being born that way........because that's all it is...CRAP. It's a choice, so don't use it to force your homo perversion on everyone else. No, I am NOT homophobic....not at all afraid of fags...just can't stomach their sick lifestyle and selfish attitudes.
Martin Pal - 14 years ago
(cont'd)
The intent is pretty clear.
As I wrote above: "If people are going to comment on this I wish they would at least know of what they are writing about." It's obvious that you guys either do not want to know, as Vince said, or you have a general disregard for people who might feel the brunt of homophobic slurs made in public by those who do so.
Martin Pal - 14 years ago
Kathi Dugan, Yes, it is all about me isn't it? What does that even mean? Because I choose to stand up for something? Harvey Milk was charged ith the same notions. I suppose you didn't see that film either? I am sorry you don't wish to acknowledge something that might affect other people other than yourself in your own selfish little world. Did you read the comments a guy named Vince wrote? Do you want to get on him, too? And I didn't bring this up. Ernest Borgnine did when he opened his mouth. None of you have even answered the question of "what if" he had made racist or anti-semitic comments instead. You are showing that you think it's okay for people to make homophobic comments. That's just an opinion, I guess. By the way, I am not "terminally unique." Next time you see people on the news gay bashing or trying to say we shouldn't have our civil rights or that marriage isn't for everyone, you see how many other terminally unique people are out there for you to degrade. I see you have an agenda to denounce me as you keep reading my posts. Are you Mr. Borgnine's publicist?
Dan R., you are also not getting the point, but as another poster wrote, most of you don't want to. So, I will take you by the hand and explain it: AGAIN. First, I did not say that you are required to vote. Mr. Borgnine is a voting member of the academy and are you suggesting that AMPAS wants it's members to go around bashing films THEY HAVE NOT SEEN? For any reason? And voting or not: This is your profession. AMPAS members thought BBM was one of the best films of the year and gave it the most nominations and by the time the oscars came around it had won more best picture awards than any other film at around 23! And I bring up Crash/racism and Munich/anti-semitism again. Your comments suggest you are saying it would be okay to say slurs about those films as well. Or is it just homophobia that you approve of?
If you think Hollywood is more accepting of gay people than any other place then it is a sad state of affairs indeed. When gay directors go to seminars at Outfest and tell actors they should stay in the closet, that's really accepting. When a movie about a gay relationship starring Jim Carrey and Ewan MacGregor can't even get a distributor in the U.S. to release it. When people like you excuse people in the industry like Tony Curtis and Ernest Borgnine and other unnamed people written about by journalists, that use homophobic slurs against a film they haven't even seen, then that is quite tolerant of you. The people posting here cannot even bring themselves to say that Ernest Borgnine probably should not have said what he did in public. That he might have kept it to himself. Instead, you all want to err on the side of some homophobic statements. That is so open of you.
Where are all the out gay leading men in Hollywood? We know there have been closeted ones for decades. Or are you okay with people being in the closet? Maybe you should have seen Brokeback Mountain and you would learn a little something about what it is like to live in the closet. If you are gay and come out of the closet and voice an opinion you get beat down by others like you, Kathi and a majority of the posters here who have commented, all in the name of defending an actor who made homophobic remarks. I am standing up for all the unnamed gay people who don't want to be called names all the time, who are afraid to be themselves and come out of the closet, who don't want homophobes to demean us and who say it is simply unacceptable for verbal gay bashing to continue.
Dan R., your statement that if Borgnine said "no, I don't care to see the Lion King" would that make him a lion hater is truly laughable. He wouldn't say such a thing. Think about it: Why would he say these words about Brokeback Mountain? Ernest Borgnine: "No. I didn't see it and I don't care to see it. If John Wayne were alive he'd be rolling over in his grave." Th
Dan R - 14 years ago
Martin P is wrong about the Academy. You are not required to vote for a best picture if you don't want to. We don't know if Ernie did or didn't vote for a best picture that year. Besides there is no other industry that is more open and more accepting of people of different colors, sexual orientations or backgrounds than show business and if you think for one second that a comment made by any one individual could somehow sway thousands of voters away from BBM to Crash, then that's just a ridiculous notion.
Dan R - 14 years ago
The fact is, Ernie didn't say, "I hate gays." He just said he didn't want to see it! That's it. Maybe sex on screen of any kind offends him. Besides, last time I checked this was America and you were suppose to be able to choose what you want to see and what you don't. If he said, "no I don't care to see the Lion King" would they be calling him a lion hater?
Kathi Dugan - 14 years ago
78-21--probably wouldn't have been quite as high if Martin P had not become the issue. He is (thanlk God) terminally unique--doesn't matter about anyone or anything else , but HIM. By now we all know that nothing Ernie could or would say would make a bit of difference to Martin--so EB9 does not need to respond.
Hey Martin time for you to gravitate to the Oscars--they have just named their folks for special recognition--perhaps you could help their selectees with a hatchet job. I thank you for helping our beloved EB. Cheers, Kathi
Martin Pal - 14 years ago
Again, Irishsmiles is another poster who completely doesn't get the point of the article. And also displays a lack of knowledge about the reasons "why" EB did not see it, the mitigating factor of why not seeing it is is important if he voted that year and also BBM is not a gay rights movie. If people are going to comment on this I wish they would at least know of what they are writing about.
irishsmiles - 14 years ago
He is one of the nicest most wonderful actor i can think of.
So he did not see a gay rights movie get over it he has earned this and so much more
Martin Pal - 14 years ago
That says it all, Kim Albertson: "He's worked with some of the biggest stars that were in the closet." When guys like the characters in Brokeback Mountain think of coming out of the closet and onto the motion picture screen, well, that's another story I guess.
kim Albertson - 14 years ago
What, Mr. Borgnine anti-gay. some one better stop smoking that funny stuff.
Read his book, the last thing he is anti- gay .He' has worked with some of the biggest stars that where in the closet. and with one word, that would have been the last time they worked. He's worked in Hollywood longer than most of us have been around. So start asking around. He has done more for this country and the Navy than any one in know in hollywood. At what time did the SAG awards, become the GLAD awards.
SAG is honoring him for a life time of acting .
Martin Pal - 14 years ago
You guys seem to forget that Mr. Borgnine is an academy member and is supposed to see all 5 films nominated for Best Picture before he votes on the award. That's different than someone just not wanting to see a film. And also, being gay is not a point of view, so when people are against gay people just being themselves it is insidious to us and about as helpful as arguing that the sky shouldn't be blue or the grass chose to be green. It's our lives, so if you're sick of us wanting our equal rights, then just let us have them. Talk about angry-- when I read ignorant things like you guys just posted.
terry - 14 years ago
So people should be bullied into accepting homosexuality? Did he state he hated gays? If so I did not see it. Did he say gays should not work? I did not see it. He stated a personal point of view when asked about the movie. Same view I had about Twlight same point of view I had about Last temptation of Christ. We do have a first amendment right in this country to speak without censourship, which groups that do not want to hear opposition to their point of view seem to fail to realize. They really make me sick with the one sided point of view they push. I am not anti gay really don't care one way or the other just makes me angry when I see people push their agenda on others...
Jack - 14 years ago
I agree 100% with Ernie. " Haven't seen it, don't care to see it". It's just not the genre of movie that us heteros care about. Also losing patience with all the pro-homosexual attitude, especially homo marraige. It was soundly defeated by Californian voters by about the same margin as this stupid poll, so now the homosexuals want to change the rules of the game to get what they want. It's just wrong, and there's going to be a backlash.
When you say "the condition in question" do you mean homophobia or being gay? Gay people have always been around, so there must be some natural or genetic based reason for it, so your supposition is a little thin. Not all bees are born to mate with the Queen.
Hello Group, My name is Frank and I suffer from homophobia. I feel that the condition in question is a genetic abnormality and that thanks to Darwinism, such genetics can not be passed along. As a Union Electrician once told me "Rubbing two lamp plugs together or rubbing two outlets together don't turn on the lights". Seems like a reasonable synopsis.
What do you all think? IMHO: Frank.
Dear Don, what we have from commenters like you and from many of the posters who answer these articles is fallacy, ignorance, prejudice, preconceived notions, opinions devoid of data, assertions which contradict actual facts, and just plain irrational hatred and bigotry. Yes, Don, you ARE homophobic. You demonstrated it with your post. My lifestyle is probably as boring as yours is so, to quote you, "don't start with that crap." The reason you don't want to acknowledge being gay is a choice is because then you would have to look at gay people differently and if you had to do that you might find that you are the one believing selfish memes and "your" beliefs have been sick. I notice all your "anger" is directed at gay men, judging from your use of the slur "fags." When is it acceptable to use racial, ethnic or sexist slurs, even behind the privacy of your keyboard? It is not. So thanks for not only showing that you are a homophobe, but a perverted example of selfish humanity as well.
Martin Pal, I believe everyone should have civil rights....but I also believe that individuals who make the choice to be a homo(which is ALL homos)should NOT get civil rights BECAUSE of their choice. Don't even start with the crap about being born that way........because that's all it is...CRAP. It's a choice, so don't use it to force your homo perversion on everyone else. No, I am NOT homophobic....not at all afraid of fags...just can't stomach their sick lifestyle and selfish attitudes.
(cont'd)
The intent is pretty clear.
As I wrote above: "If people are going to comment on this I wish they would at least know of what they are writing about." It's obvious that you guys either do not want to know, as Vince said, or you have a general disregard for people who might feel the brunt of homophobic slurs made in public by those who do so.
Kathi Dugan, Yes, it is all about me isn't it? What does that even mean? Because I choose to stand up for something? Harvey Milk was charged ith the same notions. I suppose you didn't see that film either? I am sorry you don't wish to acknowledge something that might affect other people other than yourself in your own selfish little world. Did you read the comments a guy named Vince wrote? Do you want to get on him, too? And I didn't bring this up. Ernest Borgnine did when he opened his mouth. None of you have even answered the question of "what if" he had made racist or anti-semitic comments instead. You are showing that you think it's okay for people to make homophobic comments. That's just an opinion, I guess. By the way, I am not "terminally unique." Next time you see people on the news gay bashing or trying to say we shouldn't have our civil rights or that marriage isn't for everyone, you see how many other terminally unique people are out there for you to degrade. I see you have an agenda to denounce me as you keep reading my posts. Are you Mr. Borgnine's publicist?
Dan R., you are also not getting the point, but as another poster wrote, most of you don't want to. So, I will take you by the hand and explain it: AGAIN. First, I did not say that you are required to vote. Mr. Borgnine is a voting member of the academy and are you suggesting that AMPAS wants it's members to go around bashing films THEY HAVE NOT SEEN? For any reason? And voting or not: This is your profession. AMPAS members thought BBM was one of the best films of the year and gave it the most nominations and by the time the oscars came around it had won more best picture awards than any other film at around 23! And I bring up Crash/racism and Munich/anti-semitism again. Your comments suggest you are saying it would be okay to say slurs about those films as well. Or is it just homophobia that you approve of?
If you think Hollywood is more accepting of gay people than any other place then it is a sad state of affairs indeed. When gay directors go to seminars at Outfest and tell actors they should stay in the closet, that's really accepting. When a movie about a gay relationship starring Jim Carrey and Ewan MacGregor can't even get a distributor in the U.S. to release it. When people like you excuse people in the industry like Tony Curtis and Ernest Borgnine and other unnamed people written about by journalists, that use homophobic slurs against a film they haven't even seen, then that is quite tolerant of you. The people posting here cannot even bring themselves to say that Ernest Borgnine probably should not have said what he did in public. That he might have kept it to himself. Instead, you all want to err on the side of some homophobic statements. That is so open of you.
Where are all the out gay leading men in Hollywood? We know there have been closeted ones for decades. Or are you okay with people being in the closet? Maybe you should have seen Brokeback Mountain and you would learn a little something about what it is like to live in the closet. If you are gay and come out of the closet and voice an opinion you get beat down by others like you, Kathi and a majority of the posters here who have commented, all in the name of defending an actor who made homophobic remarks. I am standing up for all the unnamed gay people who don't want to be called names all the time, who are afraid to be themselves and come out of the closet, who don't want homophobes to demean us and who say it is simply unacceptable for verbal gay bashing to continue.
Dan R., your statement that if Borgnine said "no, I don't care to see the Lion King" would that make him a lion hater is truly laughable. He wouldn't say such a thing. Think about it: Why would he say these words about Brokeback Mountain? Ernest Borgnine: "No. I didn't see it and I don't care to see it. If John Wayne were alive he'd be rolling over in his grave." Th
Martin P is wrong about the Academy. You are not required to vote for a best picture if you don't want to. We don't know if Ernie did or didn't vote for a best picture that year. Besides there is no other industry that is more open and more accepting of people of different colors, sexual orientations or backgrounds than show business and if you think for one second that a comment made by any one individual could somehow sway thousands of voters away from BBM to Crash, then that's just a ridiculous notion.
The fact is, Ernie didn't say, "I hate gays." He just said he didn't want to see it! That's it. Maybe sex on screen of any kind offends him. Besides, last time I checked this was America and you were suppose to be able to choose what you want to see and what you don't. If he said, "no I don't care to see the Lion King" would they be calling him a lion hater?
78-21--probably wouldn't have been quite as high if Martin P had not become the issue. He is (thanlk God) terminally unique--doesn't matter about anyone or anything else , but HIM. By now we all know that nothing Ernie could or would say would make a bit of difference to Martin--so EB9 does not need to respond.
Hey Martin time for you to gravitate to the Oscars--they have just named their folks for special recognition--perhaps you could help their selectees with a hatchet job. I thank you for helping our beloved EB. Cheers, Kathi
Again, Irishsmiles is another poster who completely doesn't get the point of the article. And also displays a lack of knowledge about the reasons "why" EB did not see it, the mitigating factor of why not seeing it is is important if he voted that year and also BBM is not a gay rights movie. If people are going to comment on this I wish they would at least know of what they are writing about.
He is one of the nicest most wonderful actor i can think of.
So he did not see a gay rights movie get over it he has earned this and so much more
That says it all, Kim Albertson: "He's worked with some of the biggest stars that were in the closet." When guys like the characters in Brokeback Mountain think of coming out of the closet and onto the motion picture screen, well, that's another story I guess.
What, Mr. Borgnine anti-gay. some one better stop smoking that funny stuff.
Read his book, the last thing he is anti- gay .He' has worked with some of the biggest stars that where in the closet. and with one word, that would have been the last time they worked. He's worked in Hollywood longer than most of us have been around. So start asking around. He has done more for this country and the Navy than any one in know in hollywood. At what time did the SAG awards, become the GLAD awards.
SAG is honoring him for a life time of acting .
You guys seem to forget that Mr. Borgnine is an academy member and is supposed to see all 5 films nominated for Best Picture before he votes on the award. That's different than someone just not wanting to see a film. And also, being gay is not a point of view, so when people are against gay people just being themselves it is insidious to us and about as helpful as arguing that the sky shouldn't be blue or the grass chose to be green. It's our lives, so if you're sick of us wanting our equal rights, then just let us have them. Talk about angry-- when I read ignorant things like you guys just posted.
So people should be bullied into accepting homosexuality? Did he state he hated gays? If so I did not see it. Did he say gays should not work? I did not see it. He stated a personal point of view when asked about the movie. Same view I had about Twlight same point of view I had about Last temptation of Christ. We do have a first amendment right in this country to speak without censourship, which groups that do not want to hear opposition to their point of view seem to fail to realize. They really make me sick with the one sided point of view they push. I am not anti gay really don't care one way or the other just makes me angry when I see people push their agenda on others...
I agree 100% with Ernie. " Haven't seen it, don't care to see it". It's just not the genre of movie that us heteros care about. Also losing patience with all the pro-homosexual attitude, especially homo marraige. It was soundly defeated by Californian voters by about the same margin as this stupid poll, so now the homosexuals want to change the rules of the game to get what they want. It's just wrong, and there's going to be a backlash.