I do NOT agree that homeschoolers should be allowed to participate in public school extra curricular activities. We keep focusing on sports and it isn't just sports, it is ALL extracurricular activities.
One thing that keeps getting mentioned is taxes. We in the state of VA, do NOT pay school taxes! The taxes you pay are only a very tiny portion of what goes to the school systems. We ALL pay them... people who don't have kids, seniors, as well as those that choose to homeschool! As a teacher friend of mine stated to me, you have a very fundamental reason for not having your kids attend public schools, so why should you have your cake and eat it, too?
Again, everyone keeps focusing on sports, but what about high school band, chorus, drama, etc.? In my county, those classes practice their music/plays IN CLASS. How would this new bill extend to the homeschool students? My daughter was in the band (marching and concert/symphonic) all though high school. During concert season, they ONLY practiced during class with approximately three after-school practices right before the performance. Likewise, my son is in chorus and drama. They practice for their plays IN class until they get closer to the performance date in which time they start practicing after school. He has NEVER had an after-school chorus practice.
I personally just think it isn't a great idea. Schooling, whether public, private, or home is a choice, and everyone has their reasons for doing so. Private schools have their own sports, clubs, etc. Why don't the homeschoolers organize their own?
Michelle - 12 years ago
Honestly, it doesn't matter how long it takes a child to gain their education. The fact is, there are rules in place and it would not be fair for my child, if your child gets to participate without following the same rules.
You are asking for fairness for your child, well as a parent of a public school student. I ask the same.
It is not about comparing the children, it is about making sure that ALL students have the same chance using the same rules.
By the way, I am not an opponent of HSers participating. We need to address ALL issues before going ahead with allowing it. That is simply what I am saying.
Are you saying that the rules don't apply to you? If that's the case, you probably shouldn't be participating.
Albert - 12 years ago
I am so tired of hearing “we pay taxes for the public school system ", I pay taxes for things I do not use and so do you....If you want your child to play sports in public schools, they should go to a public school. My child does not attend an In-State University, so should I get a tax break because according to you I pay taxes for the states public school system. There are grades and attendance that the student athlete must adhere to, if my child is not at school the day of the game he cannot play (are you willing to change that rule), if my child has detention or a behavioral incident he cannot play. How do we monitor that for the home schoolers.
There are many things I would like to do but I cannot because I am not a member of......
George - 12 years ago
There is no school tax in the Commonwealth of VA. so to say you pay a school tax is absurd. Your money is divided amongst the county. Yes some goes to the schools but not all your tax dollars. In some school districts now the parents have to pay for their kids to play on a school team. Yes you can write your textbooks and other school materials off on taxes. I have four kids of my own. The older three participate in school activities and Parks & Rec as well. We have to pay for them to play in parks & rec. Just like everyone else. If homeschool kids want to participate in athletic sports then they can join outside sports teams(AAU). Our school doesnt have an ice hockey team and my kid wants to play it. So I pay for him to play and he plays on a AAU team. They have alot of sports teams they can join. There are homeschool teams also. The next thing you know they will be wanting to go to school dances and prom. If you want them to join a public school function then they need to attend public schools. Some parents don't want their kids going to public schools due to safety issues or what they might learn from other kids but they want them on a public school team. They are not going to get one on one time with the coach unless they screw up. Then parents will cry they are picking on him because he doesn't go their school. My kids mantain A average in school but score pass advance on all their SOL's (520-600). This has been for years and with class room average of 27 students. Teachers are there to educate and it is up to us to reinforce what they have learned. Public and private schools have an advantage over homeschoolers and that is social interaction. I have seen and met a few that knew how to deal with a social activity. Maybe this is why they want them in public school activities to help them. So if they allow homeschoolers to play then students who go to school then don't need to attend at least five classes. The students who don't do well in school or are behavioral problems can participate as well. There are several coaches that would love that. Coaches are kicking kids off teams because of that and would be star athletes if they didn't have to. This is America and you have a right to choose! So you made a decision not put your kid in public or private school and therefore don't get the benefits.
Tiffany - 12 years ago
Michelle,
Is our real concern here my child vs. your child or ensuring each child recieves proper education and ample opportunities for a healthy, active lifestyle? It may take your child 6 hours/day to recieve information my child can obtain in 4 simply due to the availability of the teacher. It is not possible for a teacher to spend 4 hours/day in direct contact with 26 students and finish it in six hours.
Is the real reason the school requires a certain number of hours in school because those specific hours dictate whether or not your child recieves a solid education or because your school recieves funding based on attendance? My son attended public school for a couple of years prior to my decision to home educate so I'm well aware of the rules you face in terms of attendance. I just feel that's an issue to be taken with the system and not with homeschoolers.
If I can educate my child in less time, not because I'm "better" than the teachers certainly but because I have the time to spend one on one with my children, what is the point or requiring them to sit in my kitchen for two extra hours so they can participate? Doesn't it seem silly to force a child to sit in a particular room to say that he was in that room for X amount of hours? What is the real goal in that?
My goal for my children is a solid, classical education. I can honestly tell you they have ACED the standard tests each year (and no- they aren't administered by me but by a certified instructor.) I manage to achieve all of the requirements for the SOLs in their respective grade levels PLUS Shakespeare, Latin, Spanish, Logic, Composer and Art Study. Is that not good enough? Do we throw their academic rigor and excellence under the rug with the argument of them being short 30 minutes on the time they spent in the kitchen that day? What about the "hours of school" my kids spend outdoors reading required literature? Does that count for school hours? Or how about the time your child waits patiently at his/her desk while the teacher helps other students? How does that compare to the hour my dialetic stage son and I spend one on one discussing Beowulf? Do we really think the actual time is comparable?
In any homeschool family I know I can ASSURE you that child is recieving more time each day in direct educational situations than the families that I know with children in public school. How would you measure that? On the other hand, we have some days that may go 8 hours if there is a particular lesson they are struggling with or a particular lesson they are enjoying and want to pursue further- do children in public school do that?
I think the "big picture" here is being missed. Are we honestly playing children ourselves and shouting, "That's not fair! My kid had to be in school 30 minutes more than your kid!" Or as fellow parents of our future generation, can we look at what's important- raising happy, healthy, competent children and future leaders, world changers, and care givers?
Michelle - 12 years ago
I do agree with the statement that there is no way to monitor a HSer's behavior, attendance, grades, like that of a student in public school. This would have to be addressed. If my child misses more than 1/2 the day of school, he is ineligible to participate. If he is absent, he is not able to participate. Every interim and report card is scrutinized to be sure he is eligible. How are we to monitor this when we're talking about HSers? If those rules do not apply to them, then they cannot apply to the public school athlete either.
Tiffany, you asked how time spent in school is a concern? Well, each day the public school athlete is required to spend a certain amount of time in school to be eligible. This should apply to everyone and the parent should not be the one monitoring.
Tiffany - 12 years ago
To Albert, if you feel homeschoolers want things "both ways," I believe you might want to look at the facts of who really wants things "both ways." Maybe homeschoolers should stop being required to pay taxes for the public schools. It's not about having it "both ways" and getting over on anyone.
I've yet to meet a homeschooling parent who make the huge commitment to home educate because they think they are gaining something from the public school system. It's a choice, just as those who chose to send their children to private schools. It seems as if you are faulting homeschoolers for choosing to educate thier own children. What is "both ways?"
Homeschoolers pay taxes for the public school system and recieve ZERO tax breaks, purchase all of our own textbooks, supplies, instruments, and curriculum (and pay for that sports equipment the public school children use.) So, in reality, who has it both ways? It seems to me that public schools and administrators have it both ways when they insist on taking our money but provide us nothing for it.
I'm not sure where the animosity for homeschooled children and/or their parents begin or why parents who have chosen a more traditional form of education have such a negative feeling towards the homeschooling community. We don't judge you for the decision you make concerning your children's education so why do you feel the need to judge ours?
Certainly, we can put our children in parks and rec, private athletic facilities and classes- that's what many of us do - but that also comes out of our own budgets. Last I checked, most public school students (I realize some now do pay but most do not) do not pay $110/month to participate in each school sport or music program. I pay for my son's football, 5 styles of martial arts, guitar lessons, Spanish, my daughter's piano, dance, and cheerleading, and all of their PE and art classes. My husband and I also pay taxes on the music, art, foreign language, P.E., and sports your children recieve at public schools.
Choosing to home educate does not mean I don't "trust" any of the teacher's in the public school system. It means I choose to decide what education my children recieve and I choose to dedicate myself to ensuring they get it. It's in no way a negative on the teacher's at a public school. I certainly do not hold a grudge or distaste for anyone who dedicates their life to education.
I think the goal is for all children to have the opportunity to enjoy sports and keep physically fit. I'm sure scholarships play a roll in high school students' desires to play at public schools where they might be noticed by college scouts, shouldn't all talented athletes have that opportunity?
As far as the comment about eligibility- is your real concern how much time homeschooled children spend in school? I'm not clear on how that reflects in thier ability to physically function in a school sport. If you hired a private tutor to work one on one with your child and your child alone would they require the same amount of hours to learn the same subjects as they would require from one teacher who is responsible for 26 students? The state of Virginia does not require homeschoolers to meet certain hourly requirements as some other states. We do have to pass yearly testing, have our curriculum submitted to the counties, and prove our ability to educate our children. We are simply not free to do as we please. If our children do not maintain certain test scores, we have to answer to that. On average, homeschoolers score higher on educational testing nationally. I certainlly don't believe this is a double standard. There are simply different guidelines put in place.
The real goal here, in my humble opinion, is that we all do what is best for our children educationally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually based on our own beliefs and ideals.
mary - 12 years ago
This is about the requirements to play a sport in the state and the eligibility during the season. In order to be eligible to play in a game or to go to practice the students must be in school for an allotted amount of time. ( regardless if there are doctor appointments and such) Also, many times students will be not be allowed to play at practice or a game because of student conduct while at school. With homeschooled children, how to do you account for the time they are not in school when the other students do have to account for this. ( it is a double standard).
Teresa L - 12 years ago
There are a lot of reasons why parents choose to homeschool. People get so defensive when all parents want is what they believe is in the best interest of thier child. Why do you fault them for that? It is also in the best interest of the child to be active and participate in sports. If they pay taxes for those schools, then they should also benefit from the after school activities that the other students of tax paying parents enjoy.
albert - 12 years ago
The homeschoolers can not have it both ways. You chose not to attend public school for various reasons. So why should the state allow your kids to play in sports....Most of the coaches are the same teachers you feel can not educate your kids.
Michelle - 12 years ago
Homeschoolers should be allowed to play as long as they meet the requirements and pay like the rest of us. Noone is saying that they are impolite or unintelligent!
Greg - 12 years ago
The opponents have no clue what they ae talking about, home schoolers are some of the most polite, inteligent kids you will ever meet!
Debbie F - 12 years ago
Parents of homeschoolers pay the same school tax as those who send their children to public schools. I believe if they meet the eligibility requirements with respect to grades, physical condition and sportsmanship they should be allowed to play.
I do NOT agree that homeschoolers should be allowed to participate in public school extra curricular activities. We keep focusing on sports and it isn't just sports, it is ALL extracurricular activities.
One thing that keeps getting mentioned is taxes. We in the state of VA, do NOT pay school taxes! The taxes you pay are only a very tiny portion of what goes to the school systems. We ALL pay them... people who don't have kids, seniors, as well as those that choose to homeschool! As a teacher friend of mine stated to me, you have a very fundamental reason for not having your kids attend public schools, so why should you have your cake and eat it, too?
Again, everyone keeps focusing on sports, but what about high school band, chorus, drama, etc.? In my county, those classes practice their music/plays IN CLASS. How would this new bill extend to the homeschool students? My daughter was in the band (marching and concert/symphonic) all though high school. During concert season, they ONLY practiced during class with approximately three after-school practices right before the performance. Likewise, my son is in chorus and drama. They practice for their plays IN class until they get closer to the performance date in which time they start practicing after school. He has NEVER had an after-school chorus practice.
I personally just think it isn't a great idea. Schooling, whether public, private, or home is a choice, and everyone has their reasons for doing so. Private schools have their own sports, clubs, etc. Why don't the homeschoolers organize their own?
Honestly, it doesn't matter how long it takes a child to gain their education. The fact is, there are rules in place and it would not be fair for my child, if your child gets to participate without following the same rules.
You are asking for fairness for your child, well as a parent of a public school student. I ask the same.
It is not about comparing the children, it is about making sure that ALL students have the same chance using the same rules.
By the way, I am not an opponent of HSers participating. We need to address ALL issues before going ahead with allowing it. That is simply what I am saying.
Are you saying that the rules don't apply to you? If that's the case, you probably shouldn't be participating.
I am so tired of hearing “we pay taxes for the public school system ", I pay taxes for things I do not use and so do you....If you want your child to play sports in public schools, they should go to a public school. My child does not attend an In-State University, so should I get a tax break because according to you I pay taxes for the states public school system. There are grades and attendance that the student athlete must adhere to, if my child is not at school the day of the game he cannot play (are you willing to change that rule), if my child has detention or a behavioral incident he cannot play. How do we monitor that for the home schoolers.
There are many things I would like to do but I cannot because I am not a member of......
There is no school tax in the Commonwealth of VA. so to say you pay a school tax is absurd. Your money is divided amongst the county. Yes some goes to the schools but not all your tax dollars. In some school districts now the parents have to pay for their kids to play on a school team. Yes you can write your textbooks and other school materials off on taxes. I have four kids of my own. The older three participate in school activities and Parks & Rec as well. We have to pay for them to play in parks & rec. Just like everyone else. If homeschool kids want to participate in athletic sports then they can join outside sports teams(AAU). Our school doesnt have an ice hockey team and my kid wants to play it. So I pay for him to play and he plays on a AAU team. They have alot of sports teams they can join. There are homeschool teams also. The next thing you know they will be wanting to go to school dances and prom. If you want them to join a public school function then they need to attend public schools. Some parents don't want their kids going to public schools due to safety issues or what they might learn from other kids but they want them on a public school team. They are not going to get one on one time with the coach unless they screw up. Then parents will cry they are picking on him because he doesn't go their school. My kids mantain A average in school but score pass advance on all their SOL's (520-600). This has been for years and with class room average of 27 students. Teachers are there to educate and it is up to us to reinforce what they have learned. Public and private schools have an advantage over homeschoolers and that is social interaction. I have seen and met a few that knew how to deal with a social activity. Maybe this is why they want them in public school activities to help them. So if they allow homeschoolers to play then students who go to school then don't need to attend at least five classes. The students who don't do well in school or are behavioral problems can participate as well. There are several coaches that would love that. Coaches are kicking kids off teams because of that and would be star athletes if they didn't have to. This is America and you have a right to choose! So you made a decision not put your kid in public or private school and therefore don't get the benefits.
Michelle,
Is our real concern here my child vs. your child or ensuring each child recieves proper education and ample opportunities for a healthy, active lifestyle? It may take your child 6 hours/day to recieve information my child can obtain in 4 simply due to the availability of the teacher. It is not possible for a teacher to spend 4 hours/day in direct contact with 26 students and finish it in six hours.
Is the real reason the school requires a certain number of hours in school because those specific hours dictate whether or not your child recieves a solid education or because your school recieves funding based on attendance? My son attended public school for a couple of years prior to my decision to home educate so I'm well aware of the rules you face in terms of attendance. I just feel that's an issue to be taken with the system and not with homeschoolers.
If I can educate my child in less time, not because I'm "better" than the teachers certainly but because I have the time to spend one on one with my children, what is the point or requiring them to sit in my kitchen for two extra hours so they can participate? Doesn't it seem silly to force a child to sit in a particular room to say that he was in that room for X amount of hours? What is the real goal in that?
My goal for my children is a solid, classical education. I can honestly tell you they have ACED the standard tests each year (and no- they aren't administered by me but by a certified instructor.) I manage to achieve all of the requirements for the SOLs in their respective grade levels PLUS Shakespeare, Latin, Spanish, Logic, Composer and Art Study. Is that not good enough? Do we throw their academic rigor and excellence under the rug with the argument of them being short 30 minutes on the time they spent in the kitchen that day? What about the "hours of school" my kids spend outdoors reading required literature? Does that count for school hours? Or how about the time your child waits patiently at his/her desk while the teacher helps other students? How does that compare to the hour my dialetic stage son and I spend one on one discussing Beowulf? Do we really think the actual time is comparable?
In any homeschool family I know I can ASSURE you that child is recieving more time each day in direct educational situations than the families that I know with children in public school. How would you measure that? On the other hand, we have some days that may go 8 hours if there is a particular lesson they are struggling with or a particular lesson they are enjoying and want to pursue further- do children in public school do that?
I think the "big picture" here is being missed. Are we honestly playing children ourselves and shouting, "That's not fair! My kid had to be in school 30 minutes more than your kid!" Or as fellow parents of our future generation, can we look at what's important- raising happy, healthy, competent children and future leaders, world changers, and care givers?
I do agree with the statement that there is no way to monitor a HSer's behavior, attendance, grades, like that of a student in public school. This would have to be addressed. If my child misses more than 1/2 the day of school, he is ineligible to participate. If he is absent, he is not able to participate. Every interim and report card is scrutinized to be sure he is eligible. How are we to monitor this when we're talking about HSers? If those rules do not apply to them, then they cannot apply to the public school athlete either.
Tiffany, you asked how time spent in school is a concern? Well, each day the public school athlete is required to spend a certain amount of time in school to be eligible. This should apply to everyone and the parent should not be the one monitoring.
To Albert, if you feel homeschoolers want things "both ways," I believe you might want to look at the facts of who really wants things "both ways." Maybe homeschoolers should stop being required to pay taxes for the public schools. It's not about having it "both ways" and getting over on anyone.
I've yet to meet a homeschooling parent who make the huge commitment to home educate because they think they are gaining something from the public school system. It's a choice, just as those who chose to send their children to private schools. It seems as if you are faulting homeschoolers for choosing to educate thier own children. What is "both ways?"
Homeschoolers pay taxes for the public school system and recieve ZERO tax breaks, purchase all of our own textbooks, supplies, instruments, and curriculum (and pay for that sports equipment the public school children use.) So, in reality, who has it both ways? It seems to me that public schools and administrators have it both ways when they insist on taking our money but provide us nothing for it.
I'm not sure where the animosity for homeschooled children and/or their parents begin or why parents who have chosen a more traditional form of education have such a negative feeling towards the homeschooling community. We don't judge you for the decision you make concerning your children's education so why do you feel the need to judge ours?
Certainly, we can put our children in parks and rec, private athletic facilities and classes- that's what many of us do - but that also comes out of our own budgets. Last I checked, most public school students (I realize some now do pay but most do not) do not pay $110/month to participate in each school sport or music program. I pay for my son's football, 5 styles of martial arts, guitar lessons, Spanish, my daughter's piano, dance, and cheerleading, and all of their PE and art classes. My husband and I also pay taxes on the music, art, foreign language, P.E., and sports your children recieve at public schools.
Choosing to home educate does not mean I don't "trust" any of the teacher's in the public school system. It means I choose to decide what education my children recieve and I choose to dedicate myself to ensuring they get it. It's in no way a negative on the teacher's at a public school. I certainly do not hold a grudge or distaste for anyone who dedicates their life to education.
I think the goal is for all children to have the opportunity to enjoy sports and keep physically fit. I'm sure scholarships play a roll in high school students' desires to play at public schools where they might be noticed by college scouts, shouldn't all talented athletes have that opportunity?
As far as the comment about eligibility- is your real concern how much time homeschooled children spend in school? I'm not clear on how that reflects in thier ability to physically function in a school sport. If you hired a private tutor to work one on one with your child and your child alone would they require the same amount of hours to learn the same subjects as they would require from one teacher who is responsible for 26 students? The state of Virginia does not require homeschoolers to meet certain hourly requirements as some other states. We do have to pass yearly testing, have our curriculum submitted to the counties, and prove our ability to educate our children. We are simply not free to do as we please. If our children do not maintain certain test scores, we have to answer to that. On average, homeschoolers score higher on educational testing nationally. I certainlly don't believe this is a double standard. There are simply different guidelines put in place.
The real goal here, in my humble opinion, is that we all do what is best for our children educationally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually based on our own beliefs and ideals.
This is about the requirements to play a sport in the state and the eligibility during the season. In order to be eligible to play in a game or to go to practice the students must be in school for an allotted amount of time. ( regardless if there are doctor appointments and such) Also, many times students will be not be allowed to play at practice or a game because of student conduct while at school. With homeschooled children, how to do you account for the time they are not in school when the other students do have to account for this. ( it is a double standard).
There are a lot of reasons why parents choose to homeschool. People get so defensive when all parents want is what they believe is in the best interest of thier child. Why do you fault them for that? It is also in the best interest of the child to be active and participate in sports. If they pay taxes for those schools, then they should also benefit from the after school activities that the other students of tax paying parents enjoy.
The homeschoolers can not have it both ways. You chose not to attend public school for various reasons. So why should the state allow your kids to play in sports....Most of the coaches are the same teachers you feel can not educate your kids.
Homeschoolers should be allowed to play as long as they meet the requirements and pay like the rest of us. Noone is saying that they are impolite or unintelligent!
The opponents have no clue what they ae talking about, home schoolers are some of the most polite, inteligent kids you will ever meet!
Parents of homeschoolers pay the same school tax as those who send their children to public schools. I believe if they meet the eligibility requirements with respect to grades, physical condition and sportsmanship they should be allowed to play.