Daily Poll: Should faith-based hospitals that receive government funding be required to provide assisted dying to patients?

23 Comments

  • Krista Aasman - 6 years ago

    Many hospitals specialize in different aspects of care for our community. The Mazankowski Alberta Heart Institute in Edmonton specializes in complex cardiac care and surgery. Many patients are transferred there from other facilities in distress due to an MI for cardiac catheterization. I think it is reasonable to transfer patients to a specialty area/hospital to receive the best care they require unique to their situation. This ensures they will be guided by a team that has the best training and can provide the best support in their journey, no matter what that is.

  • Natalie S - 6 years ago

    Allowing MAID has opened a Pandora's box of problems from forcing doctors and institutions to go against their own consciences and deeply held beliefs in providing health care, to killing patients who are not terminally ill. We are now discussing harvesting organs from those who receive MAID (http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/dying-organ-donation-benefits-1.4405020) as well as making it an option for the mentally ill and under-aged (http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/terminally-ill-children-as-young-as-12-should-have-euthanasia-choice-expert-panel-urges).

    This has and will go way beyond a hastened death for the very, very terminally ill.

    We will all be the poorer if doctors and institutions cannot truly have their own character, and are forced to act like non-thinking entities, performing acts against their consciences because the state enforces it.

  • Margaretha Smits - 6 years ago

    Please note that St. Paul's Hospital took in and treated AIDS patients in the 1980s when HIV infections started and many patients died; it was unclear how to prevent infection at that time. St. Paul's Hospital had/has not done any abortions and this was their response: we will take your AIDS patients. Now St. Paul's is the centre of excellence for HIV/AIDS. I spoke recently with an older gentleman who pointed out that it was even difficult to get housekeeping to clean the rooms of AIDS patients. Housekeeping staff would not come in the room except with extra-ordinary measures. I myself have seen a nurse leave Vancouver to work in Alberta in a nursing home, when AIDS started, because she was a single mother and afraid for infection and possible death.
    In light of all this: choices have been made for a long time in hospitals. Not all hospitals do all procedures. Also St. Paul's, in the 1980s, chose life in the treatment of a then very dangerous disease, HIV infection. I feel catholic hospitals have every right to make choices now in not providing all procedures, inclusive of MAID. There is an option for St. Paul's maybe to provide, and become a centre of palliative care.

  • Michael - 6 years ago

    Saying that an institution isn't required to provide a certain service is not the same thing as denying that service to people. Most secular medical institutions will still be willing to provide MAID, so the access will still be there. But if we start pushing people to betray the very reason they devote their lives to the medical field in the first place (that is, their convictions on the sanctity of life), we're going to see a significant drop in medical professionals and thus, medical care as a whole. What is the greater loss: the financial instability of several medical institutions in a rapidly growing province, or the burden of being able to receive MAID in only some institutions?

  • Sarah - 6 years ago

    Objecting against it with conscience may not have to be religious. So, you cannot just point at religion, and say, those who are against assisted suicide and mercy killing, are medieaval zealots. Perhaps, it is the misguided belief in the full right to decide everything yourself, and make others comply, which is the real religion now that cannot be questioned.

  • Sam Blaine - 6 years ago

    I want to be treated only in hospitals that do not do MAiD. It change the culture from one supporting living well while dying to one that causes dying.

  • Drew Shaw - 6 years ago

    Religion has no place in any educational or health context. This is 2018. Religious health facilities should be nationalised and taken over by the provincial ministries of health. Leave the Dark Ages behind, where they belong. If you don't like assisted dying, then don't use it. Stop inflicting your religious indoctrination and nonsense on everyone else.

  • Stephen McCulloch - 6 years ago

    We really need to reexamine whether faith based institutions should get public funding at all.

  • J.Doe - 6 years ago

    For your consideration: MAiD public opinion poll open today
    Patrick Dumelie This message was sent with High importance.
    Sent:January 10, 2018 2:36 PMTo:Patrick Dumelie
    Over the past 18 months there has been much media coverage about Medical Assistance in Dying in Canada--including the role of faith-based providers, such as the Covenant family. Today, The Province newspaper has a one-question public poll on this topic. I encourage you to participate in thepoll as it is collecting responses today so that your voice can be heard on this important Canadian issue. http://theprovince.com/news/local-news/daily-poll-should-faith-based-hospitals-that-receive-government-funding-be-required-to-provide-assisted-dying-to-patients/wcm-12e88b0b-9533-4703-83ae-8d920db1d639 Thank youPatrick Dumelie, CEO

  • Timothy - 6 years ago

    Catechism of the Catholic Church: 2276

    http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a5.htm#2276

    __________________________________

    Euthanasia

    2276 Those whose lives are diminished or weakened deserve special respect. Sick or handicapped persons should be helped to lead lives as normal as possible.

    2277 Whatever its motives and means, direct euthanasia consists in putting an end to the lives of handicapped, sick, or dying persons. It is morally unacceptable.

    Thus an act or omission which, of itself or by intention, causes death in order to eliminate suffering constitutes a murder gravely contrary to the dignity of the human person and to the respect due to the living God, his Creator. The error of judgment into which one can fall in good faith does not change the nature of this murderous act, which must always be forbidden and excluded.

    2278 Discontinuing medical procedures that are burdensome, dangerous, extraordinary, or disproportionate to the expected outcome can be legitimate; it is the refusal of "over-zealous" treatment. Here one does not will to cause death; one's inability to impede it is merely accepted. The decisions should be made by the patient if he is competent and able or, if not, by those legally entitled to act for the patient, whose reasonable will and legitimate interests must always be respected.

    2279 Even if death is thought imminent, the ordinary care owed to a sick person cannot be legitimately interrupted. The use of painkillers to alleviate the sufferings of the dying, even at the risk of shortening their days, can be morally in conformity with human dignity if death is not willed as either an end or a means, but only foreseen and tolerated as inevitable Palliative care is a special form of disinterested charity. As such it should be encouraged.

  • Denise Lui - 6 years ago

    The government funding is money from the tax. The tax is from the tax payers. The tax payers include people who do not believe in assisted dying despite with or without religions. It is a moral issue and when we allow assisted dying, unending moral issues from families will begin and human rights of survival may be at risk by being influenced by force, guilt and may be controlled by some family members. Government/s intention may have the agenda of cutting the high cost of medical expenses. Value of lives is much higher than the amount of money. Natural death with respect is essential. Should balance and seek ways to have a positive and correct objective of how to keep sick and old people see the value of life and being respected with love and care in the last stage of their lives. Spend money on palliative care instead of high tech medical cost and never think of getting rid of them.

  • L Gar - 6 years ago

    We should learn from the experience of Belgians where euthanasia is legal. We were warned by doctors there but our govt would not listen. Here are some stats:
    Nearly half (47%) of euthanasia deaths are not reported (according to a study carried out in Flanders in 2007): This is illegal.
    - Euthanasia deaths should be carried out by doctors, but according to a 2007 study, nurses are doing them: This is illegal.
    - Some euthanasia deaths are carried out without consent (according to a 2007 study in Flanders): This is illegal.
    Legalized assisted suicide leads to a slippery slope:
    Recently, a depressed healthy man who was retired, but alone and lonely, died by euthanasia in the Netherlands. In Belgium, a healthy depressed woman died from euthanasia after experiencing the break-up of a long-term relationship. In Switzerland, a man died by assisted suicide after receiving a wrong diagnosis.

    With advances in pain management, medication can relieve over 98% of pain. Most of the pain a person suffers, (since most of physical pain can be relieved) is emotional pain. They think they want to die because they feel that they are a burden to their family, the hospital or society. We have to reassure them that they have value and dignity - that they are not a burden. A patient wants unconditional love and support - not death.

  • Jill - 6 years ago

    Most of the comments here have no basis in fact or understanding of MAID. MAID in Canada is law, a patient has the right to this choice, as does a healthcare worker have the right to not administer it. There are lots of procedures one has to go through before qualifying for MAID, you can't just have it, and you have to be of competent mind. I am both a healthcare worker and someone who lost their mother to MAID. My mother was in a faith based hospital in palliative care. She was forced onto the street one day to have her assessment done as an administrator did not want it done on the property. She also had to leave the property for the day she had MAID. She did not experience compassionate care from this faith based organization when she made this decision. She should not have been treated like a criminal because of her choice. A patient in a publicly funded hospital or health care facility should have access to this service. There are a limited number of practitioners who administer MAID, it is there choice to do this, they are not forced into it, but they should be able to administer it wherever it is best for the patient. Until you have gone through this with a loved one or a patient with a debilitating terminal disease you have no idea what it is like. You don't have to support MAID but you do have to support your patients.

  • compassionate nurse - 6 years ago

    Wow. What kind of employees do we have that view MAID as killing patients? Seriously. Do you even work with any types of pts requesting MAID? Do you actually think all Palliative care facilities are equal? Absolutely not!!! Not only am i an R.N, but my 66yr old mom received MAID in June for an ALS like illness that no one could diagnose or treat!! The red tape and bullshit we encountered was disgusting!!! My poor mom was forced to get wheeled across the street from a covenant site to discuss the request for MAID? What would you call this? It is legal and we were all made to feel like criminals!!! Our wonderful Ethics V.P, Gord Self had made us do this last minute ( after he had already granted permission!)The fact that not everyone supports MAID, is not lost on me. Nor do i expect it. What i do expect is our supposed Covenant Values of Respect and Compassion for each and every pt!!!! Doesnt happen and it's disgusting!!! MAID IS NOT MURDER!!! If you haven't gone through the experience with a pt or loved one, you have no right to judge those that have. You say let God judge??? Why are you judging then???

  • Jane Doe - 6 years ago

    I find it quite unfortunate that the CEO of Covenant health informed it's employees (including myself) to vote on this matter. Although I work for this catholic based organization, I know my values and thoughts on this matter are likely not shared by most covenant health employees. By having the CEO ask covenant health employees to vote on this matter automatically makes the results of this poll somewhat biased. I have yet another reason to feel somewhat ashamed to work for this organization. Working in healthcare aren't we supposed to be person centred, meaning our care should actually be based on the clients personal needs and wants for THEIR life - even if that means ending their life.

  • Luise Grav - 6 years ago

    Seems to me that those medical professionals who have a conscientious objection to assisting in ending the life of a patient should be able to opt out of involvement in the procedure. I can't see why a hospital employee's opinions should override the end-of-life decisions made by the patient. There is not always a clear line between palliative care and assisted dying anyways.......a Morphine pump for someone in terrible pain that is soon to die often stops the patient's heart......When pain-relief has been made a priority over extending life, the line is very blurred. If a medical professional is so concerned about contributing to death, they could just stay out of palliative care.

  • Kat - 6 years ago

    Wow, very disheartened by the comments here. MAiD is NOT killing, a hospital is not going to kill you while you are your most vulnerable! If that is as articulate as you can be about your stance on this subject perhaps you should do some more research. It seems rather juvenile to throw around a shocking word like, “kill” to gain attention to your opinion. Health care is severely mismanaged and underfunded. If my tax dollars are supporting a Faith based hospital that can pick or choose what services that they offer seems fraudulent. If you want to dictate what services you provide than return all public funds. Let your organization fund you. If you take public funds then you need to offer the full spectrum of care. Choosing to hide behind your religious beliefs seems somewhat cowardly to me. As a human being I certainly do not agree with prostitution, drug use and criminal activity. But as a health care worker I can put my conflicting beliefs aside and provide the best level of care possible in a non biased manner. MAiD is not murder or killing. It is simply ensuring that a person who has exhausted all other options does not have to suffer while they wait for the inevitable. To all of the people that have unsubstantiated objections- may you one day have the opportunity to sit by and watch a loved one suffer and struggle while they wait to pass. There is no prayer or belief in the world that will make that okay.

  • Diane Pleasance - 6 years ago

    MAID is a Personal choice and Nobody, but Nobody has the Right to force their Religious beliefs on one who chooses MAID. Whatever happened to the saying “First Do No Harm”? If you dont think being in a depreciating body while your mind is clear and having no quality to your life is not harmful, I hope you never get a terminal illness.

  • John Doe - 6 years ago

    FYI....Covenant CEO in Edmonton has encouraged Covenant staff to vote on this poll. Not sure why an Alberta based organization is interfering with a local issue.

    Patrick Dumelie
    Further to my last email regarding the MAiD public opinion poll, I understand that some people are getting error messages or not able to link directly to the poll.

    Thank you for bringing this to my attention.

    Please use the link below (Control + click or copy and paste).

    http://theprovince.com/news/local-news/daily-poll-should-faith-based-hospitals-that-receive-government-funding-be-required-to-provide-assisted-dying-to-patients/wcm/12e88b0b-9533-4703-83ae-8d920db1d639

    Patrick Dumelie

    CEO

  • Jane Doe - 6 years ago

    Facilities who decide to refuse access to doctor assisted suicide should openly display this in their belief's and values, so individuals can choose a place to pass that respects their decisions.

  • Aart Blokhuis - 6 years ago

    How can you ever expect a place of healing and care to provide killing of patients as an option? It is an outrageous request, to say the least. Hospitals proven to provide "Health Care" ought to be doubly rewarded for having a "No Kill" policy from conception until natural death. Hospitals who perform Killing procedures ought to be stripped of government funding. This would restore people's confidence in the purpose and procedures performed in hospitals for our society rather than to sow distrust and fear into the hearts of an aging population. Offer palliative care instead.

  • Emily Richardson - 6 years ago

    This is a matter of conscience, which cannot be called less than a life and death issue! Those of us who believe our personal freedom is related to our allegiance to a power higher than the state, are in danger of being denied our rights of conscience. We are all of us more than tax dollars! We are human beings first, and Canadians second. Our faith holds that life is sacred, and the values underlying this belief motivated our ancestors to build up our health organizations, to protect the vulnerable. Suffering can be alleviated by many means, including: medication, care, companionship, and looking at the higher meaning of life. Canadians of faith are willing to keep on providing these supports to life. Why are we being pressured, then, to kill people, against our consciences? Do we have religious freedom in this country, or do we not? Emily Richardson

  • Renee Schmitz - 6 years ago

    I pay taxes and I want to stay in a hospital that won't kill me when I am vulnerable. If my money is going towards health care, I should be able to get service at a faith-based hospital that respects my beliefs to not kill. I also work at one and pay taxes, so I should be able to work at one that will not require me to go against my conscience and that won't force me to kill my patients.

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