Although, to be perfectly honest, I found the five key episodes vastly superior to Twilight's Kingdom. Sure, there will always be people who will complain about the key episodes and their specific problems, from Rainbow Dash building a bad relay team in her own key episode, to the Wonderbolts and Breezies' characterization, respectively, to the many ways Applejack's key episode was average. But in my opinion, they gave the Mane Five meaningful character-development without the need to jack up the stakes as sky-high as possible.
It was during Twilight's key episode, unfortunately, that I had a HUGE problem. All the character-development the Mane Five once gained in their own key episodes are all discarded and disposed of to make way for Twilight's Super Saiyan bad-assery. In other words, Meghan McCarthy deliberately disposed of MLP's core friendship themes, just to turn it into DBZ, not just with the fight, but also the power-imbalance between Twilight and her friends, similar to the heavy power-imbalance between saiyan Z-warriors and non-saiyan Z-warriors.
anon - 10 years ago
Great, now we've got 12-year-old Internet atheists in here (oh those atheists; always bringing religion into everything). And a guy with a very NSFW icon further down. Yeah, I think it's past time to stop reading the comments...
Rockpath5 - 10 years ago
@Matt
Lol, now that's nonsense!
Matt - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness
I really think you need to lie down for a bit bud. You are making less sense than religion right now.
aaa - 10 years ago
aaaaa
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
I hate myself and you shall pay for It
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
Ans I eat my own shit.
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
Again, why even bother with Twilight's Kingdom Part Two? It victimized and disposed of the Mane Five as a cheap, lazy excuse to demonstrate Tirek's powers, just so that we could have a fight that demonstrates a HEAVY power imbalance between Twilight and her friends.
And you LOVED that power imbalance! You wanted Twilight's friends to be victimized, so that she could become a Super Saiyan bad-ass! After all, it worked for DBZ, where tons of non-saiyan Z-warriors are brutalized and murdered just as an excuse to get the saiyans to save the day with their performance-enhancing transformations! And you had no problem with that in Naruto and Bleach, where TONS of their protagonists' friends get victimized and murdered as a lazy justification to demonstrate a villain's powers, and to get the main-protagonists (and Sasuke) to save the day!
Discord Sparkle - 10 years ago
@Stillz I can definitely see where you're coming from with Spike. Him not being in Sweet and Elite really bothered me since if anyone should be at Twilight Sparkle's birthday party, he should
Medicine Cat - 10 years ago
@Discord Sparkle I agree with you on the two parts. For the sake of polls it seems to me that two-parters should be considered one episode.
Stillz - 10 years ago
@Sarah-Kay
Pay a little attention, and you'll see Applejack getting tons of love, left and right, along with the rest of the mane six.
Besides, if you're going to complain about Applejack's treatment at the hands of the fandom, imagine how Spike fans have felt since the very BEGINNING. You're way fucking better off, be glad.
Discord Sparkle - 10 years ago
@Pinkiebrony, I agree that Twi's Kingdom had some great character development, but I think that it's best taken as a whole, not just part one or two, so I voted for Testing
Song1 - 10 years ago
[The Rainbooms] Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! [Rainbow Dash] Awesome as I wanna be [The Rainbooms] Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! [Rainbow Dash] Awesome as I wanna be First you see me riding on a sonic boom Got my guitar shreddin' up the latest tune There is nothin' you can do to beat me I'm so good that you can't defeat me [Rainbow and the Rainbooms] Yeah, I'm awesome, take caution Watch out for me, I'm awesome as I wanna be (Yeah!) I'm awesome, take caution Watch out for me, I'm awesome as I wanna be [The Rainbooms] Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! [Rainbow Dash] Step aside now, you're just gettin' in my way I got sick chops you could never hope to play When it comes to makin' music, I'm the ruler You wish you could be twenty percent cooler [Rainbow and the Rainbooms] Yeah, I'm awesome, take caution Watch out for me, I'm awesome as I wanna be (Yeah!) I'm awesome, take caution Watch out for me, I'm awesome as I wanna be!
gfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg - 10 years ago
I'm a dumb Idiote with no live and I am Attacking Everyone Because I have Nothing Better to do.
PinkieBrony - 10 years ago
Sorry if my comment was to strong on stating my opinion. That's just how I feel. If you like a different episode more that's fine too. :) All the episodes of season 4 were super amazing!
PinkieBrony - 10 years ago
@(Everyone who posted something I disagree with) OBJECTION!!!!!!!! Because of my OP-inion. The episode Twilights kingdom part 2 is the wining episode in my professional episode opinion because I liked the amazing character development of Twilight and Discord in that episode. The fight scene in the episode actually wasn't my favorite part of that episode, and if that was the best part of that episode then I would have chosen a different episode. (Episode is fun word to say :) sorry about the overuse. I did it for my own entertainment. I regret nothing!)
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Medicine Cat That's not all. I was banned from five entire message boards for these rants, and probably Intense Debate, where I leave comments in all of those Equestria Daily articles. And I think they were stripping me of my freedom of self-expression and speech.
Medicine Cat - 10 years ago
@Discord Sparkle The projection really is extraordinary. The fact that part of it is that everyone who disagrees with him is secretly wishing for mass ponycide (but not him, whose fantasy it actually is) is particularly creepy.
But seriously, enough said. If we don't engage hopefully he'll quietly creep off to a Dragonball ZZZ....zzzz....zzzzz site.
Julia Roberts - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness
You can't be serious, you must be trolling, i mean wtf!! is wrong with you?
Discord Sparkle - 10 years ago
Oh I'm sorry, I didn't realize I was on tumblr, where everything is racist/sexist/oppressive and putting words in people's mouths is the norm.
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Discord Sparkle Well, it's true! Everyone chose Twilight's Kingdom the most on the account of its racist fight scene, which proved the dominance and superiority of Twilight Sparkle on the account of being an alicorn, while her friends get victimized and disposed of because of their species as well.
Applejack? Rainbow Dash? Fluttershy? And their respective key episodes? They all suck because they were badly written, and Meghan McCarthy made them bad because she was racist to their species and considered Twilight vastly superior because of her species. Therefore, she's as much racist as all of you!
You're all racists for liking the Twilight/Tirek fight but hating the Rainbow Power, Rainbow Castle, and three of the key episodes! You WANT MLP to become a show about racism because of that DBZ-style fight-scene, and the way it was inspired by an anime series ABOUT racism!
Discord Sparkle - 10 years ago
Look at how he projects onto others and thinks they're saying things they've never said. Look, I can do that too. He loved You'll Play Your Part but he hated Let the Rainbow Remind you. That means he only cares when it's just princesses singing and you hate the mane six. Incidentally, Dragon Ball Z is boring, the original Dragon Ball is far better.
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Discord Sparkle Oh? So it's okay to have racial inequality and power imbalance between an alicorn like Twilight and her friends of other pony species? You loved the fight scene but hated the Rainbow Power, Rainbow Castle, and three of the key episodes. That means you WANT MLP to become Dragon Ball Z from now on, where Twilight's friends are brutally murdered on the account of their species, while Twilight becomes the ultimate solution to everything on the account of her species.
After all, this racism thing worked for DBZ as well! Murder or push aside every Z-warrior who wasn't a saiyan at all, just so that the saiyans themselves can become the ultimate saviors of the universe!
Discord Sparkle - 10 years ago
@Medicine Cat Whoops, sorry. Yeah, this guy's almost definitely either a troll or an idiot, and there's no point talking to either one
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@pones I apologize.
But here's the thing. Breezies, Leap of Faith, Rainbow Falls... those and the other two key episodes gave Twilight's five friends a moment of spotlight and character-development, even if it was all stupid build-up to their inevitable disempowerment and victimization included as a lazy justification to demonstrate Tirek's powers. And here, your enjoyment of the Twilight/Tirek fight and utter disregard for the Rainbow Power, Rainbow Castle, and three of the key episodes constantly make it sound like that Meghan McCarthy caused the show to jump the shark, in other words abandon the show's core friendship themes to become a bloated Dragon Ball Z knock-off for the rest of time. And I don't want to believe that at all.
Sarah-Kay - 10 years ago
Applejack loses again... I feel so alone in this fandom, lately I've really started to lose interest in the show. The creators AND the fanbase treats Applejack and her fans so poorly. It's supposed to be FUN to be a part of a fandom, but I'm just an oucast.
pones - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness: Do you even read comments? That guy didn't even mention Twilight's Kingdom. Idiot.
Medicine Cat - 10 years ago
@Discord Sparkle Oops! Discord, not Diamond. Sorry, it's late.
Medicine Cat - 10 years ago
@Diamond Sparkle Don't feed the troll.
Rockpath5 - 10 years ago
Breezies are awesome, bitches!
CMC_Scootaloo - 10 years ago
@ Isn't_it_amazing:
That says the one that likes EQG, one of the blandest and lowest quality movies ever made.
I don't think you can judge the quality of this episode.
And Scott Sonneborn does not have to go only because the episode does not meet your taste, he's a great writer and the episode is very good.
Discord Sparkle - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness Anonymouse didn't even MENTION Twilight's Kingdom in his post, what's wrong with you?! I'm pretty sure you're the only one here that sees nothing in Twilight's Kingdom except for the fight scene if you're even seeing it in places where no one is talking about Twilight's Kingdom at all
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@anonymouse By mentioning Breezies and Leap of Faith in a negative light, but liking Twilight's Kingdom solely for its bloated fight, you're implying that Meghan McCarthy had given up on the show's core friendship themes, just to turn it into Dragon Ball Z from now on. And that you WANT her to for the rest of the entire show.
anonymouse - 10 years ago
Testing Testing was phenomenal. One of the best Dash episodes.
I gotta say I wish Leap of Faith's and Breezies positions would be swapped though.
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Kicks_McGee FINALLY, someone with some semblance of intelligence!
Once again, Twilight's Kingdom was worse: The complete and utter victimization of Twilight's five friends as an excuse to demonstrate Tirek's powers, and the bloated fight scene that did nothing other than demonstrate a HUGE power imbalance between Twilight and her friends.
aibr - 10 years ago
Wow! So many good episodes to choose. I wonder what other ponies have wrote about these great episodes.
...
...why did I read comments. When I learn it's not worth the pain of all the whining.
Kicks_McGee - 10 years ago
Whoa, whoa, Leap of Faith is on the VERY BOTTOM now?! *flips table* *rage-quits*
Just an Annon - 10 years ago
Of course, the comments section is full of people degrading the #1 choice. We need less hipsters in the world...
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Shadow Rose Well, I found Twilight's Kingdom to be worse, because it took away all the character-development given to the Mane Five in their own key episodes, and replaced it with uselessness and disposability, just to turn both Twilight and Tirek into Super Saiyan bad-asses. And they LOVED the finale JUST for that stupid fight.
Why do I keep bringing this up? Because Dragon Ball Z did the same thing on a regular basis, where tons of non-saiyan Z-warriors, despite their years of martial-arts training, all get victimized and murdered, just so that saiyans like Goku, Vegeta, and their sons could save the day on the account of them being saiyans. That problem would eventually pass on to Naruto and Bleach, whereby Naruto, Sasuke, and Ichigo become the only solutions to everything, while every one of their friends, despite their combat abilities, also get disposed of. One Piece, though, not so much, mostly because with few exceptions, the Straw Hat Pirates are almost always given something to do that prove their resourcefulness to Luffy, and as a result barely get victimized themselves.
But the problems that plagued DBZ, Naruto, and Bleach all had to pass on to MLP's own Season Four finale, just because Meghan McCarthy had to end the fourth season with as huge a bang as possible. As a result, she rendered the first five key episodes meaningless, at least up until the end, and almost destroyed everything that made My Little Pony such a household name in the first place, including the core friendship themes.
don - 10 years ago
Testing,Belles toil,Inspiration,Vanilli. They added to the crew, Twi kingdom was a hell of a finish but it added no depth to her.
Besides anything that builds the players the better. The rest is fluff.
Stillz - 10 years ago
@Smithers If that's how you feel about the song, then it accomplished exactly what it was supposed to. If Spike's epic recovery in the climax didn't justify it in your eyes like the death and rebirth of a DC character...well, you can't please everyone.
Kicks_McGee - 10 years ago
Someone's a-trollin' this pollin'. "Breezies" just jumped up five places from where it was yesterday (which is where it's been almost since the start).
Stillz: Best Spike episode of all time? How about least watch-able Spike scene of all time?
I don't have any problem with a lack of sporting events, (In any case we saw enough of the only event we cared about to justify it ending the way we knew it would.)
But seriously, how does one answer "you've just volunteered to sing a song you know nothing about in front of a huge crowd" with "I'll just make something up about how they have nice trees (even though they live in the sky and trees grow on the ground)" instead of "run for the hills because that can't make it any worse right now"?
dashie24: As much as I loved "Testing," my first thought when RD was initially unfazed by the test was that she obviously already knew everything there was to know about them, I guess I never really managed to suspend my disbelief that she didn't. (Or maybe I'm just petty for the episode proving me wrong.)
Rockpath5: Imma let you finish, but the breezies are the one thing that G3 did better than G4. Somehow the spindly appearance never struck me as cute, whereas the G3 breezies where simply adorable, tiny (flying, antenna-bearing) ponies. (This, coming from someone who would have hated MLP prior to G4, but has watched the old episodes for historical interest and found them to be not all bad. [For reference G4 > G1 original series > G3 > G1 MLP tales. (Seriously, Tales is shit; skip it)])
Badly Drawn Turtle: "make sure that all of the characters, but with special focus on Pinkie, Spike, and Rarity, are in character." Surely out of everypony, Pinkie is the most likely to have her character turn in completely unexpected directions?
Oh and re. "a pattern, I tell you, a pattern?" If patterns were that infallible we'd have all been playing Pokémon grey not too long ago.
As for long comments, I'm only a fraction of the way up the list of comments I could respond too; things can only get worse (until I hit 4k chars).
EternalNothingness: "Up until the ending itself, the fight deliberately SACRIFICED and DISREGARDED the Mane Five's hard work and dedication toward earning their own keys, just so that Twilight could become a Super Saiyan bad-ass in the most pandering, superficial fashion imaginable." And what came of that fight? Complete stalemate and no more. What that fight sequence proved was that neither Twilight nor Tirek's Saiyan powers where useful for anything except looking bad-flank. In the end Twilight's willingness to give everything for her friends, including Discord, was her only meaningful action; that is what ultimately earned her her key and allowed the mane cast to save the day.
ilm126: Well, I can help you with part of that decision; don't bother with the premier because that poll has been and gone. This is the S4E14-26 poll! :-)
Actually, my comment RE the super-saiyan boss fight in E26 is one that would not have occurred to me without reading other comments on this poll, so thanks to those (especially EN) that inspired it. It is an important message (that I missed first time around) that what is by far the most serious fight between two characters we have seen in the whole series, had Twilight's insane magical abilities amount to sweet buck-all when it mattered. Individual physical or magical strength was shown to be ultimately irrelevant in the face of... [[all right, who's willing to do the title drop this time? Discord: Oh very well, I suppose I owe you]]
Discord: ...the Magic of Friendship!
[[Discord Happy now? Me: very]]
Shadow Rose - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness
The reason why Rainbow Falls was very low on the previous poll had nothing to do with the fans devaluing Rainbow. It's regarded by many to be the worst episode of Season 4. It had terrible writing, flanderization, and many pointless scenes that drag on way too long. Worse than Spike at Your Service, I dare say, for despite its one major flaw, I got more than a few chuckles out of it, especially the "Mary Sue fanfic" scene with Rarity and Rainbow. Fans don't devalue Rainbow. Not even Derpy could save the episode.The Breezy episode is heavily disliked for being overly toyetic and girly, even though it technically isn't even THAT toyetic; there are NO Mane 6 breezified toys as of yet, and I frequent stores every so often. That episode gets too much hate. Other episodes that don't receive a fraction of hatred are more toyetic than Fluttershy's key episode. As for Leap of Faith, people tend to devalue Applejack episodes for being rather safe. The episodes tend to lack memorable tidbits of humor, which is why they are easily forgotten. It had nothing to do with people wanting to see Applejack suffer for the prize of seeing super-powered Twilight fight. It wasn't that Twilight CHOSE alicorn magic over her friends. She was GIVEN the power by the other princesses. Thus, I don't think her friends were devalued. The Mane 6 weren't captured so that Twilight would gain all of the magic. She HAD the magic even before they were kidnapped.
What's wrong with the power gap? The power wasn't even hers to begin with. As I mentioned below, giving Twilight all of the alicorn magic was the safest option available at the time. A triple alicorn attack would have been WAY riskier. Twilight's "power" in the episode was circumstantial. On her own, she's a "higher than above average" unicorn in terms of magical prowess. A progidy, but far from being the all-power being among her friends that you implied she was. She didn't even know her friends were captured in the first place, so she didn't purposefully sacrifice and victimized them to gain the alicorn magic. "Twilight herself became the ultimate solution to everything on the account of her being an alicorn herself." Not exactly. If this was true, Celestia, Luna, or even Cadence could have saved the day themselves. Twilight was most likely chosen for her connection to the Element of Magic and/or her natural talent for magic. As I said earlier, Celestia could have been the only other recipient of the magic due to her connection to said element. Yet, she couldn't because the connection no longer works. (Also, Luna never had a connection with the Element of Magic, and sun power > moon, so she couldn't have done it.)
I get it. I get annoyed when people love an episode JUST for one scene. It's pretty fickle. Every episode has at least SOMETHING to offer, but when an underrated episode gets a pass because another episode has an epic moment, it's pretty sad.
Bloomix - 10 years ago
I voted for Twilights kingdom part 2, best episode IMO. :)
Stillz - 10 years ago
Very well, then. You can't picture Spike being anything but awkward, I can easily see him fitting in (perhaps even having an equally meaningful scene with Maud if time constraints could be adjusted without sacrificing anything). Let's agree to disagree.
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Appletini I know! Isn't that annoying?
Again, the Mane Five had to work for their keys, where they had to resolve conflicts based on their Elements of Harmony and teach somepony else about their Elements. And, despite all that hard work and effort, the biggest thanks they got from Meghan McCarthy, at least up until the ending, was having their magic sucked dry by a giant, parasitic centaur from an old 1980's MLP movie. To add more salt to the wound, Twilight had to absorb three other alicorn princesses' magic, and then fight Tirek in a battle that did nothing else other than demonstrate a HEAVY power gap between Twilight and her friends.
And people LOVED it. They'd spit on some of the key episodes, and not bother with the Rainbow Power and Rainbow Castle. But when it comes to that big, bloated fight and that power imbalance between Twilight and all of her friends, they're okay with it, even though they were never okay with the same thing happening in DBZ, as well as Naruto and Bleach.
Appletini - 10 years ago
It seems as if a large number of people blindly vote for season finales (Except for the only good one, The Best Night Ever).
Discord Sparkle - 10 years ago
I went with Testing, Testing, 1, 2, 3 since I can't vote for Twilight's Kingdom as a whole. Part 2 is nothing without part 1
ilm126 - 10 years ago
Gah! This poll IS the hardest one to vote on!
There are the season premiere and the finale to consider, the fan loved ones as well, plus my personal favourite "Testing, Testing, 1, 2, 3". Gah! A really hard choice here...
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Badly Drawn Turtle Well, here's the thing. I don't want to be a part of the majority, who loved Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 for its bloated fight scene, but dislike other key episodes like Rainbow Falls, Breezies, and Leap of Faith. In my opinion, Twilight's Kingdom was the WORST of the key episodes, because it casually discarded the Mane Five and disregarded their contributions to the season-long story-arc, just to turn Twilight into the stupidest, most pandering Super Saiyan bad-ass in the universe. I mean, say what you will about three of the other key episodes, plus Rarity Takes Manehattan and Pinkie Pride, at least all five of them gave the Mane Five meaningful character-development, right up until they were victimized and disposed of for the sake of turning Twilight into a big, bloated bad-ass.
Badly Drawn Turtle - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness
Please stop. You're giving me a headache trying to follow your (oddly Dragonball-themed) argument. You're also being highly aggressive to anyone who replies to you. That isn't good.
Badly Drawn Turtle - 10 years ago
@Stillz "...when was the last time Spike's presence needed to be explained to anyone?"
Okay, I admit that was a bit of a stretch. I stand by everything else I've said, however.*
"...but you make the mistake of applying the characteristics of our social groups to a fairy tale universe in which those psychological barriers are much more lenient."
No, actually. I make the reasonable assumption of applying the characteristics of our social groups to a fairy tale universe written by humans in which the psychological barriers are generally shown to be just as strong. You're looking at the show through rose-colored glasses; the pony society isn't nearly as nice as some people make it out to be.
"Everything in your second paragraph goes against the show's messages of friendship and harmony;"
I'm sorry if what I'm describing goes against the show's message. What I'm describing is the situation in the show, so the show must not be following the message as well as you thought. Spike's situation is unusual, and it needs resolution eventually (hopefully there'll be a Spike sub-arc this coming season the way there's a CMC sub-arc of sorts), but a non-Spike episode like "Maud Pie" is not where it should start.
"...what's so harmonious about a dragon having no place among the characters who provide the bulk of his social interaction? How can one be “shoehorned” into their own family?"
The thing is, I'm not arguing from harmony, I'm arguing from the evidence provided in the show, as well as the writers' view of the makeup of an episode. I never said anything about Spike being "shoehorned" into the group, I said; "Shoehorning him in to an episode where he isn't necessary isn't giving him his due, it's... shoehorning him in where he isn't necessary.". Notice that I said "episode", not "group" or "family"? Yeah, that was a significant part of that sentence's meaning. I also said "where he isn't necessary", which is a situation-specific description, and quite different from "no place among the characters...", which is an absolute and much stronger a statement then I made.
And then you say I don't have imagination, or am being biased. A, my imagination is perfectly fine, thank you. B, how exactly could I be biased, here? I'm not emotionally invested in Spike being in the episode or not in the episode. Bias comes from emotional investment, so it's unlikely I'm biased. I thought about it again... and all I can picture is "awkward Spike", where he stands around being the butt of a visual pun or two, and doing nothing of import. That is the worst type of Spike, and bad writing to boot. You don't add in a character if they don't contribute to the story; which is what I keep saying, while it seems you keep hearing something else.
*"Don't patronize people who disagree with you by pretending you're right and they're wrong."
The last two paragraphs of my previous comment were uncalled for. I'm sorry for that. I know excuses are bad, but I've had a bad week, so my filter isn't as strong as it usually is.
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Adam Burt Why? Because it demonstrated a heavy power gap between Twilight and her friends? Did you WANT the Mane Five to be discarded and even murdered, so that Twilight could become the ultimate solution to everything for the rest of the series, a la every saiyan and non-saiyan in DBZ?
And what about the five key episodes? The Mane Five worked very hard to earn their keys, and you're devaluing and discarding their individual-yet-combined efforts just to make way for Twilight's stupid Super Saiyan bad-assery? Do you WANT the show to give up on its own friendship themes to become Dragon Ball Z from now on until the end of the series?
Fun1k - 10 years ago
I like how there is no contest. :>
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Shadow Rose Look, it's just that Breezies and Leap of Faith have the least amount of votes right now, while Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 is earning the most votes out of all the episodes mostly because of that fight scene. That meant that, in some shape or form, you're devaluing not only Fluttershy and Applejack, but also in some regard Rarity, Pinkie Pie, and Rainbow Dash, most especially since in the last poll, Rainbow Falls also received very few votes.
I DO want to believe that the Mane Five did play their parts in their own key episodes, and as a result believe that it was enough to compensate for their victimization and disposability in Twilight's Kingdom. But not when tons of people are liking the the finale for its stupid fight and the way it demonstrated a heavy power gap between Twilight and her friends.
Besides, the reason I'd say something like that is because MLP's battle was akin to DBZ, but what's ALSO akin to DBZ was the victimization and disposability of the hero's friends, exchanged for the hero's over-empowerment. In DBZ, every non-saiyan Z-Warrior was going to die or get benched on the account of being non-saiyans, and the only ones who were always going to save the day were the saiyans, like Goku and Vegeta. Likewise, Twilight's friends were singled out on the account of not being alicorns, while Twilight herself became the ultimate solution to everything on the account of her being an alicorn herself.
Stillz - 10 years ago
Testing is different from Maud because the former was work-related and the latter was recreational. And honestly, when was the last time Spike's presence needed to be explained to anyone? Never. Shave off some of your imaginary run time.
The rest of your logic is sound, but you make the mistake of applying the characteristics of our social groups to a fairy tale universe in which those psychological barriers are much more lenient. Everything in your second paragraph goes against the show's messages of friendship and harmony; what's so harmonious about a dragon having no place among the characters who provide the bulk of his social interaction? How can one be “shoehorned” into their own family?
It is very possible I'm wrong, but so far the only excuse I can fathom is your disturbingly clinical, “he doesn't fit the demographic, and would therefore get in the way no matter how small his participation”. It's extremely easy to picture him fitting smoothly into the episode...without taking up more time than what's already there, even! The fact that you cannot suggests a serious lack of (or just biased) imagination, and a lack of faith in the writers to craft a streamlined narrative.
Don't patronize people who disagree with you by pretending you're right and they're wrong. I may have an unpopular opinion, but yours is no more or less valid.
Maxxarcade - 10 years ago
This poll was tough, but I ended up picking Testing, Testing 1,2,3. It was a very relatable episode for me, and even more so when coming from my favorite pony.
Twilight's Kingdom was a close second with all its epicness, but I felt SO bad for the Mane 5 in that episode.
Adam Burt - 10 years ago
Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 for me, love the fighting sence.
Medicine Cat - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness. Just wow. Your whole premise is so completely around the bend that I'm just not interested taking the ride. Sorry
Badly Drawn Turtle - 10 years ago
@Stillz "You won't hear me complaining about “Testing, Testing...” because he didn't have a job there, so his inclusion would've been pointless."
... You have yet to explain how "Maud Pie" is different. Spike's inclusion would, again, be pointless. It would not be "better" to give him a five second cameo just so that he exists. He would be an unusual element; a talking point (look, a dragon!) that would have to be explained to Maud, taking up episode time. He has few clear interests to share with Maud (an oversight they will eventually correct, I hope), and would contribute absolutely nothing to the episode that wasn't already there.
And, despite what you seem to think, Spike is not one of the Main Six. He is one of the ten main characters, but the Main Six have a special dynamic that Spike isn't a part of. He doesn't wield an element, he doesn't have to navigate life as a relatively young adult, and he isn't a mare. To say that not including him is a slight against him is to forget that it's just as bad for his character when he's around and not relevant. Again, this episode was about Maud and Pinkie, along with Pinkie's closest friends. Spike may be a friend, but he isn't a mare, he isn't an adult, and ultimately, he isn't as close to the others as he is to Twilight; Pinkie wouldn't think of him as a "best friend". If that makes you sad, I'm sorry, but it's the truth. Spike is the sidekick, as "Power Ponies" highlights. He's the youngling, and the token boy. There is no avoiding that he is different, and different can take attention from the plot of another character's story. Shoehorning him in to an episode where he isn't necessary isn't giving him his due, it's... shoehorning him in where he isn't necessary. It's bad writing, and the people working on the show are all the better for realizing when he isn't needed in a particular episode.
That's not to say I don't like Spike; he's a great character (when written well, at least - like in the first Equestria Girls). But I like Pinkie, too, and I don't complain when she isn't present. A like Fluttershy, but she doesn't have to be there all the time. If you honestly lose faith in the fandom when someone explains how writing and stories work, and defends the decisions of the writers; then I'm sorry for you. Sorry, not just because you aren't fully enjoying what the fandom has to offer, but because this attitude could lead to serious problems later in life. If you can't tolerate people with different opinions, then I have some news: you will never find anyone who agrees with you on every single thing. You'll be alone.
I guess I'll end with a suggestion: Take a step back; consider all that I've said, and if you don't like me for it, then don't like me. But remember it all the same; another refrain for that little voice in the back of your head who's job it is to tell you when you might be wrong.
Shadow Rose - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness
How was the Mane 5's hard work towards earning their keys diminished by the sacrifice? Twilight knew what was at stake. The fight was intense not just because of the action, but because of what the audience knows that the Mane 6 has been through in Season 4. Everyone worked hard to remain true to their element and teach lessons to others, even if they weren't initially aware of it ;the Tirek battle/magic sacrifice was the last step for Twilight to realize that Friendship IS magic to attain the key. Twilight was the main solution because she is the current bearer of the Element of Magic. All three princesses thought as much. She was chosen to carry the power of the other princesses because she could withstand it. Celestia is presumably the strongest of the three, considering the moon's illumination is caused by the sun's reflection, yet probably couldn't withstand holding the magic because of probably two reasons. One, 'magic' isn't her forte; her magic is related to the sun, not 'magic' in general. Two, Celestia was no longer bound to the Element of Magic, meaning she literally could not handle all of the magic, which makes sense if we assume that Twilight's 'magic' cutie mark doesn't factor into this. At one point, she probably could carry all of that magic because she WAS the bearer of the Element of Magic. I didn't think she was chosen because she happened to be an alicorn among her friends. In case you wanted to say that letting the three princess keep their power to rush Tirek was a plausible idea, it really wasn't. If Tirek got a lucky shot out of just one of the princesses, even Cadence, he could easily overpower them, considering he already consumed much of Equestria's magic. Twilight would have absolutely no bargaining chip for her friends, who would promptly be killed with complete disregard since he'd already have all of the magic. There'd also be no chance for Discord to realize his mistake and ask for forgiveness; in short, there would be NO lesson taught, NO 6th key obtained, and an unopened box. Also, Twilight didn't dispose of her friends. Tirek did. He sucked their magic and used them as bargaining chips, yet didn't care about them. Twilight was the one who treasured their safety more than the possession of the great magic she had that was insufficient to win the fight.
Frankly, NOBODY would want to see the Mane 6 murdered just for the sake for some action. Where did you get that idea?
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Medicine Cat "Wow?" That is all you will say, right? Nothing more specific than that?
Medicine Cat - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness Wow.
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
@Medicine Cat Here's the thing. Unlike other shows of its era, like Power Rangers and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, DBZ did not promote friendship and teamwork. When Akira Toriyama revealed Goku as a saiyan, and established that only saiyans can increase their power levels infinitely through their Super Saiyan forms, he wrote himself into a corner on what kind of stories he could write, as well as promoted unhealthy messages like natural selection and genetic destiny. And I HATED DBZ for what it unintentionally promoted.
That was the Twilight/Tirek fight in a nutshell: Dispose of the hero's friends and reduce them to helpless extras, while the main-protagonist becomes the ultimate solution to everything on the account of her being an alicorn compared to her friends. Up until the ending itself, the fight deliberately SACRIFICED and DISREGARDED the Mane Five's hard work and dedication toward earning their own keys, just so that Twilight could become a Super Saiyan bad-ass in the most pandering, superficial fashion imaginable.
And yet, you liked that finale more than the other five key episodes. You'd DISREGARD the Mane Five for the sake of seeing Twilight become a Super Saiyan bad-ass. You probably even want them MURDERED to show off more of Twilight's bad-assery!
Medicine Cat - 10 years ago
@EternalNothingness I would hazard a guess that it was popular with MLP fans because it was a terrific MLP episode. I'd further venture a guess that you didn't like it primarily because it wasn't a Dragonball episode.
EternalNothingness - 10 years ago
Why the Hell would Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 receive the most votes out of all the episodes? It victimized and disposed of the Mane Five, after having their own individual key episodes, just as a lazy excuse to demonstrate how much of an overpowered monster Tirek is, and so that they could also demonstrate how much of a Super Saiyan bad-ass Twilight was.
If anything, I get the feeling that people LOVED the way Twilight's friends were disempowered and victimized, and WANTED them to be sidelined and murdered so that Twilight could become Super Saiyan Goku. This is most especially true when you look at the five key episodes, which developed mixed receptions galore, as well as the Rainbow Power and Rainbow Castle, neither of which were well-received themselves despite giving Twilight's friends relevancy to the season-long story-arc. This adds even more evidence to the fact that people want Twilight's friends to get murdered for the sake of empowering Twilight, just because the same happened in DBZ, where every non-saiyan was sidelined or murdered, just so that the saiyans like Goku and Vegeta could save the day like the overpowered Mary Sues that they are.
Shadow Rose - 10 years ago
Voted for Maud Pie. Unlike the majority, based on previous poll results, I didn't vote on an episode JUST for one awesome moment it may have had. I'm somewhat surprised that Leap of Faith isn't a bit higher because "OMG LYRA." Sure, Maud demolished those rocks and used a rock-nuke, but that wasn't why I voted for Maud Pie. It was genuinely interesting to see a character so vastly different from the cheery norm we see in Ponyville interact with the Mane 6. I don't mind Spike's exclusion. He wasn't necessary. Yes, I'm a bit biased since I don't care for him to much, but I still think it would be TOO much to include him in. I don't hate him personally; his episodes aren't usually good and his character doesn't seem dynamic enough to convince me that I should care about him. I do feel bad when he's used for physical humor though. It's almost as though the writers has no place for Spike. As though Ponyville has no place for Spike. If Maud was introduced too soon or if Spike was forced to talk to her in a 5-second scene, it would feel forced and unnatural. Plus, if we had to cut things out, we might have had to cut awesomely entertaining scenes such as Maud's Engaging Poetry.
Episodes should only include characters necessary for the plot and who will produce worthwhile interactions. (Despite this, Daring Don't ROCKED. Why do so many people dislike that episode?) Maud Pie was a great piece of work. No doubt about it, of quartz.
Stillz - 10 years ago
@Badly Drawn Turtle You're 100% right; not every character needs to be in every episode. Half the mane six didn't need to be in “Testing, Testing...”, and four out of the six didn't need to be in “Daring Don't”. I'm pretty sure you're intentionally putting the worst possible spin on my words to support your straw man argument. What I'm saying is: it's only when all six ponies are slotted in, and Spike needlessly cut, that my enjoyment is dashed. You won't hear me complaining about “Testing, Testing...” because he didn't have a job there, so his inclusion would've been pointless.
I'm no writer, so I can't rightly say what he could have contributed to “Maud Pie”. And we'll probably never have answers to questions like that since the writers would apparently rather sterilize their imaginations than put them to the task of finding a place for him among the group (regardless of what friends he has outside the six, they're still his closest, so it's baffling that he wasn't as much a priority when meeting Pinkie's sister). But that _doesn't_ mean you get to proclaim there's nothing he could have possibly added. Here's my idea: Spike could've met Maud, offered her tea, exchanged one or two awkward glances with Twilight, and joined the gang at the Pie farm. That's it. The episode's narrative dynamic is not interfered with, and it is improved by acknowledging that he's part of their goddamn lives.
“Maud Pie” is an episode that I will never feel good about, and the more people tell me to stop hating something that genuinely drags down my high spirits while trying to justify an orphan character's lack of involvement with his surrogate family, the less I'll like this fandom as well.
@smotly If Scootaloo or Sweetie had been missing from “Babs Seed” (the equivalent of what happened to Spike – whose situation is quite different – in “Maud”), then maybe you'd have reason to throw your tantrum. The CMC aren't an inseparable unit like the mane six appear to be.
Badly Drawn Turtle - 10 years ago
@Stillz Oh, I'm sorry. Your definition of fun is "obviously Spike needs to be in every episode, and when the writers don't include him, it must be a purposeful slight against his character." I've got news for you; not every character needs to be in every episode. In fact, that was one of the main legitimate complaints about Season 4: the writers tried to stuff all of the main cast into the episode too often. If there are too many characters, then less time is spent on any one character or the interaction of any two, and the plot (generally focused on only one or two characters primarily) suffers. Ask yourself not were Spike is, but what, exactly, he would have added to an episode like "Maud Pie". If he wouldn't have anything interesting to contribute to an interaction with Maud, then including him would have been a strain on the already short time frame of an episode. If he would have contributed something unique, then all the worse, because this episode is supposed to be focused on Pinkie and Maud, not Spike. The last thing a writer wants is to have a secondary character steal the spotlight from the intended focus. (Don't get the wrong idea, here. By "secondary character", I mean one who's around, but not the main focus of the episode. Twilight, Fluttershy, RD, Rarity and AJ were all secondary characters in this episode.)
@smotly There's also the simple fact that that not everyone is around all the time. It would get ridiculous if Spike never left Twilight's side to do his own thing (I imagine he must have some friends outside the main six, he isn't asocial, and has separate interests of his own like they all do), or if the Crusaders were literally always shown together (again, separate interests, separate lives). Why, for instance, would Scootaloo be hanging around during the Sisterhooves Social when she didn't have a sister until Season 3? It would be awkward, unnecessary, and bad writing for shoving in an extra character just because. (Extra, as in not useful to the story being told.)
Please, everyone, stop hating on episodes just because they don't include some character or other. If all of the characters were around all of the time, the writers would be significantly constrained in what they could write about; both to include everypony (and dragon) and to make a story heard over the din of excessive character interactions. PIck an episode like "Pinkie Apple Pie" and shove just one more character into it. No matter who you pick (Flutters, Rarity, Scootaloo, Bonbon) it ruins the dynamic of the episode. There is simply no room for another character in the story. This is less obvious, but still true, for most episodes. The writers aren't attacking any characters; they're trying to tell a good tale.
MichaelTS0148 - 10 years ago
There's always that one (or two) episode(s) that always dominate these polls. Jeebus.
NamelessNP - 10 years ago
Possibly the hardest set of episodes to choose from, a lot of fun and memorable episodes here.
Shame they're overshadowed by the fight with Tirek for so many people though.
smotly - 10 years ago
@Stillz I know what you mean.I have the sam issue with Scootaloo,whenever AB and SB appears without her(Inspiration Manisfestation,Sisterhooves Social,few other)my blood starts to boil...Same goes with Spike,he is one of the most important characters in the show(Twilight's first REAL friend-i'm not counting Shining Armor)and he is treated poorly.
I voted for Leap of Faith-Big Mac Sharknado,Flim and Flam being smart,and pretty good lesson+plus i liked the song.
I'm not suprised by the order of the Episodes,maybe except Leap of Faith(AJ deserves more!)
Nightmare_Shinigami - 10 years ago
I voted for Maud Pie.
Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 might have that awesome Fightscene, but for me it became less impressive, because Twilight wasn't fighting with her own Power, that she have trained since she could use Magic, but with the Power just given to her
Maud on the other Hand was able to throw a Rock way harder than Rainbow (without even trying) and saved her Sister from Boulder. Both are Scenes, where she was using the Strenght she was building up for working on a Rockfarm, not some random Power she got just before.
Also I'm glad that Simple Ways got last Place in this Poll, since it's my most hated Episode. The Swapped Roles-Segment might have been Funny under other Circumstances, but what killed that Episode for me is the Fact that my favorite Pony was turned into a stereotypical High School-Girl with a Crush on some random new Guy (even with a Stalker-Shrine). Even Blueblood was better, since he was introduced in a Phantasy-Segment in the 3rd Episode (where we still have to learn about the Mane 6) and was really introduced in the Season 1 Finale... And there Rarity didn't act like an Idiot
Stillz - 10 years ago
@Badly Drawn Turtle You're failing to interpret much of what I typed and jumping to conclusions. Sheesh, I'm not saying, "Nobody like MY favorite episode!? You suck!" I'm annoyed that an episode that went to obscene lengths to cut him from the main cast's social circle is getting so much more approval. That goes against what the show is about to me: friendship, equality, inclusion, diversity, etc. Every time I see the mane six without Spike, my optimism take a blow.
Alex I. - 10 years ago
"Testing, Testing" bar none. That episode flowed like butter. It's the best episode of the whole show as far as character interaction, world building, and plot goes.
I'm okay with the second half of "Twilight's Kingdom" getting first, but can "Testing, Testing, 1, 2, 3" get second? It totally deserves it.
Plus, Pinkie's "Rapin' History of the Wonderbolts".
Bolt the Super-Pony - 10 years ago
Of course Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 is going to win. It was the most bold, epic, and daring (as far as controversial content goes; coming only second overall to The Last Roundup) episode of the season!
derpyshan - 10 years ago
I haven't seen Twilight's Kingdom, Equestria Games and the last Rarity episode (suddenly I lost interest in the show by the times those episodes aired), but my favorite of this bunch, and from the season four, was Filli Vanilli.
Badly Drawn Turtle - 10 years ago
@Stillz If your definition of fun is "Everyone agrees with my choice of favorite episode", then it would be pretty hard to have fun in any fandom, or in life in general.
This choice was agony only comparable to second Season 2 poll. There aren't any episodes I didn't like, and only two that I could even say are low on my list. It came down to a choice between:
"Filli Vanilli" with the fantastic song woven throughout the episode (Yes, good enough that I can ignore Pinkie being completely out of character (Seriously, though; it was Pinkie Pie way back in Season 1 who told Dash that Fluttershy was too sensitive to prank. There should be someone who's job it is to go through each script as they're written and make sure that all of the characters, but with special focus on Pinkie, Spike, and Rarity, are in character.).);
"It Ain't Easy Being Breezies" because Breezies and the lesson of being cruel to be kind;
"Leap of Faith" because it reflected so very well a real world scenario (Scam artists still do the same thing that the Flim Flam Brothers did in this episode. Yes, real people fall for it by the hundreds. It often takes the form of "faith healing", which makes people even more gullible by adding supposed religious support to the tricksters' words. You can also compare it to the current scourge of "alternative medicine", which as a general rule claims something ridiculous and then falls back on the arguments of the Flim Flam Brothers if someone challenges them.) and how lying to make someone feel better ultimately does more harm than good;
"Testing Testing 1, 2, 3" because it was full of adorable Rainbow Dash/Twilight interactions;
and "Twilight's Kingdom Part 1" for the multi-princess song and the highlighting of both Twilight's and Discord's doubts about their current positions.
Ultimately though, the winner for me, hooves down, has to be "For Whom the Sweetie Belle Toils". No, random Luna-hater, it wasn't "because Luna". It was because Luna, and Sweetie, and Rarity mixing together to tell possibly the deepest and most heart-piercing tale in the series so far. It had everything; world-building, continuity-nods that were important to the plot, mentor having a real connection with student's plight, the Mistake Made in Rage, the Toil for Redemption, dream sequences, and the all-around feel; looking back, it's hard to understand how it was a choice for me at all.
...Now, with this one and Scootaloo's "Sleepless in Ponyville", we can only hope that Apple Bloom's Luna visit is just as epic. (Of course it will happen; it's a pattern, I tell you, a pattern!)
Yes, this was a long comment. I have no regrets. Not for this comment, at least. I have plenty of other regrets, though...
TheBagelPony - 10 years ago
This is the toughest poll ever! lol
I'm gonna have to go with Equestria Games because it was not only my favorite Spike episode, but one of my all-time favorites too! :D
Maran - 10 years ago
I voted for Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 but now that I see the results I wish I had voted for Leap of Faith. It's a great episode and it's gotten too few votes.
Rockpath5 - 10 years ago
It Ain't Easy Being Breezies was one of the best episodes of all time.
Stillz - 10 years ago
@Abraman Which is fine, except for the margin by which Spike's most spectacular episode is being overwhelmed by an episode that pretended he didn't exist. It's the most disheartening thing I've seen all week (and I was having a pretty good week after one of the best artists around resurfaced as DfectiveDvice). Reminds me why it's next to impossible to have any fun in this fandom when other fans are involved.
Kicks_McGee - 10 years ago
Every Applejack fan should give a vote of appreciation to the amazing "Leap of Faith" - the best Applejack episode since "Applebuck Season" in S1. It's currently polling WAY too low.
Abraman - 10 years ago
@Stillz really it's more like people had other favorite episodes than EG.
Abraman - 10 years ago
OH WHAT A SURPRISE
Dashie24 - 10 years ago
Voted for "Testing, Testing, 1, 2, 3..." which was my favorite episode in Season 4, possibly the whole series. It was funny and heartwarming, and now Dashie is in the Wonderbolt Reserves! :)
I can see why “Somepony to Watch Over Me” only has 2 votes. Why the hell is Sonneborn coming back?! But yeah, Boulder FTW!
Stillz - 10 years ago
Oh yes, and it's being crazy dominated by Maud Pie, the episode that treated Spike like absolutely nothing. Sometimes I really do hate this fandom's tastes.
Stillz - 10 years ago
Equestria Games, the best Spike episode of all time, only has a shred of votes. Are people STILL bitching and whining about how it didn't focus on any sporting events!?
AgentDan10 - 10 years ago
I KNEW that "Twilight's Kingdom 2" was gonna be top and "Maud Pie" 2nd. :P
Although, to be perfectly honest, I found the five key episodes vastly superior to Twilight's Kingdom. Sure, there will always be people who will complain about the key episodes and their specific problems, from Rainbow Dash building a bad relay team in her own key episode, to the Wonderbolts and Breezies' characterization, respectively, to the many ways Applejack's key episode was average. But in my opinion, they gave the Mane Five meaningful character-development without the need to jack up the stakes as sky-high as possible.
It was during Twilight's key episode, unfortunately, that I had a HUGE problem. All the character-development the Mane Five once gained in their own key episodes are all discarded and disposed of to make way for Twilight's Super Saiyan bad-assery. In other words, Meghan McCarthy deliberately disposed of MLP's core friendship themes, just to turn it into DBZ, not just with the fight, but also the power-imbalance between Twilight and her friends, similar to the heavy power-imbalance between saiyan Z-warriors and non-saiyan Z-warriors.
Great, now we've got 12-year-old Internet atheists in here (oh those atheists; always bringing religion into everything). And a guy with a very NSFW icon further down. Yeah, I think it's past time to stop reading the comments...
@Matt
Lol, now that's nonsense!
@EternalNothingness
I really think you need to lie down for a bit bud. You are making less sense than religion right now.
aaaaa
I hate myself and you shall pay for It
Ans I eat my own shit.
Again, why even bother with Twilight's Kingdom Part Two? It victimized and disposed of the Mane Five as a cheap, lazy excuse to demonstrate Tirek's powers, just so that we could have a fight that demonstrates a HEAVY power imbalance between Twilight and her friends.
And you LOVED that power imbalance! You wanted Twilight's friends to be victimized, so that she could become a Super Saiyan bad-ass! After all, it worked for DBZ, where tons of non-saiyan Z-warriors are brutalized and murdered just as an excuse to get the saiyans to save the day with their performance-enhancing transformations! And you had no problem with that in Naruto and Bleach, where TONS of their protagonists' friends get victimized and murdered as a lazy justification to demonstrate a villain's powers, and to get the main-protagonists (and Sasuke) to save the day!
@Stillz I can definitely see where you're coming from with Spike. Him not being in Sweet and Elite really bothered me since if anyone should be at Twilight Sparkle's birthday party, he should
@Discord Sparkle I agree with you on the two parts. For the sake of polls it seems to me that two-parters should be considered one episode.
@Sarah-Kay
Pay a little attention, and you'll see Applejack getting tons of love, left and right, along with the rest of the mane six.
Besides, if you're going to complain about Applejack's treatment at the hands of the fandom, imagine how Spike fans have felt since the very BEGINNING. You're way fucking better off, be glad.
@Pinkiebrony, I agree that Twi's Kingdom had some great character development, but I think that it's best taken as a whole, not just part one or two, so I voted for Testing
[The Rainbooms] Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! [Rainbow Dash] Awesome as I wanna be [The Rainbooms] Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! [Rainbow Dash] Awesome as I wanna be First you see me riding on a sonic boom Got my guitar shreddin' up the latest tune There is nothin' you can do to beat me I'm so good that you can't defeat me [Rainbow and the Rainbooms] Yeah, I'm awesome, take caution Watch out for me, I'm awesome as I wanna be (Yeah!) I'm awesome, take caution Watch out for me, I'm awesome as I wanna be [The Rainbooms] Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey! [Rainbow Dash] Step aside now, you're just gettin' in my way I got sick chops you could never hope to play When it comes to makin' music, I'm the ruler You wish you could be twenty percent cooler [Rainbow and the Rainbooms] Yeah, I'm awesome, take caution Watch out for me, I'm awesome as I wanna be (Yeah!) I'm awesome, take caution Watch out for me, I'm awesome as I wanna be!
gfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggfgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg
I'm a dumb Idiote with no live and I am Attacking Everyone Because I have Nothing Better to do.
Sorry if my comment was to strong on stating my opinion. That's just how I feel. If you like a different episode more that's fine too. :) All the episodes of season 4 were super amazing!
@(Everyone who posted something I disagree with) OBJECTION!!!!!!!! Because of my OP-inion. The episode Twilights kingdom part 2 is the wining episode in my professional episode opinion because I liked the amazing character development of Twilight and Discord in that episode. The fight scene in the episode actually wasn't my favorite part of that episode, and if that was the best part of that episode then I would have chosen a different episode. (Episode is fun word to say :) sorry about the overuse. I did it for my own entertainment. I regret nothing!)
@Medicine Cat That's not all. I was banned from five entire message boards for these rants, and probably Intense Debate, where I leave comments in all of those Equestria Daily articles. And I think they were stripping me of my freedom of self-expression and speech.
@Discord Sparkle The projection really is extraordinary. The fact that part of it is that everyone who disagrees with him is secretly wishing for mass ponycide (but not him, whose fantasy it actually is) is particularly creepy.
But seriously, enough said. If we don't engage hopefully he'll quietly creep off to a Dragonball ZZZ....zzzz....zzzzz site.
@EternalNothingness
You can't be serious, you must be trolling, i mean wtf!! is wrong with you?
Oh I'm sorry, I didn't realize I was on tumblr, where everything is racist/sexist/oppressive and putting words in people's mouths is the norm.
@Discord Sparkle Well, it's true! Everyone chose Twilight's Kingdom the most on the account of its racist fight scene, which proved the dominance and superiority of Twilight Sparkle on the account of being an alicorn, while her friends get victimized and disposed of because of their species as well.
Applejack? Rainbow Dash? Fluttershy? And their respective key episodes? They all suck because they were badly written, and Meghan McCarthy made them bad because she was racist to their species and considered Twilight vastly superior because of her species. Therefore, she's as much racist as all of you!
You're all racists for liking the Twilight/Tirek fight but hating the Rainbow Power, Rainbow Castle, and three of the key episodes! You WANT MLP to become a show about racism because of that DBZ-style fight-scene, and the way it was inspired by an anime series ABOUT racism!
Look at how he projects onto others and thinks they're saying things they've never said. Look, I can do that too. He loved You'll Play Your Part but he hated Let the Rainbow Remind you. That means he only cares when it's just princesses singing and you hate the mane six. Incidentally, Dragon Ball Z is boring, the original Dragon Ball is far better.
@Discord Sparkle Oh? So it's okay to have racial inequality and power imbalance between an alicorn like Twilight and her friends of other pony species? You loved the fight scene but hated the Rainbow Power, Rainbow Castle, and three of the key episodes. That means you WANT MLP to become Dragon Ball Z from now on, where Twilight's friends are brutally murdered on the account of their species, while Twilight becomes the ultimate solution to everything on the account of her species.
After all, this racism thing worked for DBZ as well! Murder or push aside every Z-warrior who wasn't a saiyan at all, just so that the saiyans themselves can become the ultimate saviors of the universe!
@Medicine Cat Whoops, sorry. Yeah, this guy's almost definitely either a troll or an idiot, and there's no point talking to either one
@pones I apologize.
But here's the thing. Breezies, Leap of Faith, Rainbow Falls... those and the other two key episodes gave Twilight's five friends a moment of spotlight and character-development, even if it was all stupid build-up to their inevitable disempowerment and victimization included as a lazy justification to demonstrate Tirek's powers. And here, your enjoyment of the Twilight/Tirek fight and utter disregard for the Rainbow Power, Rainbow Castle, and three of the key episodes constantly make it sound like that Meghan McCarthy caused the show to jump the shark, in other words abandon the show's core friendship themes to become a bloated Dragon Ball Z knock-off for the rest of time. And I don't want to believe that at all.
Applejack loses again... I feel so alone in this fandom, lately I've really started to lose interest in the show. The creators AND the fanbase treats Applejack and her fans so poorly. It's supposed to be FUN to be a part of a fandom, but I'm just an oucast.
@EternalNothingness: Do you even read comments? That guy didn't even mention Twilight's Kingdom. Idiot.
@Discord Sparkle Oops! Discord, not Diamond. Sorry, it's late.
@Diamond Sparkle Don't feed the troll.
Breezies are awesome, bitches!
@ Isn't_it_amazing:
That says the one that likes EQG, one of the blandest and lowest quality movies ever made.
I don't think you can judge the quality of this episode.
And Scott Sonneborn does not have to go only because the episode does not meet your taste, he's a great writer and the episode is very good.
@EternalNothingness Anonymouse didn't even MENTION Twilight's Kingdom in his post, what's wrong with you?! I'm pretty sure you're the only one here that sees nothing in Twilight's Kingdom except for the fight scene if you're even seeing it in places where no one is talking about Twilight's Kingdom at all
@anonymouse By mentioning Breezies and Leap of Faith in a negative light, but liking Twilight's Kingdom solely for its bloated fight, you're implying that Meghan McCarthy had given up on the show's core friendship themes, just to turn it into Dragon Ball Z from now on. And that you WANT her to for the rest of the entire show.
Testing Testing was phenomenal. One of the best Dash episodes.
I gotta say I wish Leap of Faith's and Breezies positions would be swapped though.
@Kicks_McGee FINALLY, someone with some semblance of intelligence!
Once again, Twilight's Kingdom was worse: The complete and utter victimization of Twilight's five friends as an excuse to demonstrate Tirek's powers, and the bloated fight scene that did nothing other than demonstrate a HUGE power imbalance between Twilight and her friends.
Wow! So many good episodes to choose. I wonder what other ponies have wrote about these great episodes.
...
...why did I read comments. When I learn it's not worth the pain of all the whining.
Whoa, whoa, Leap of Faith is on the VERY BOTTOM now?! *flips table* *rage-quits*
Of course, the comments section is full of people degrading the #1 choice. We need less hipsters in the world...
@Shadow Rose Well, I found Twilight's Kingdom to be worse, because it took away all the character-development given to the Mane Five in their own key episodes, and replaced it with uselessness and disposability, just to turn both Twilight and Tirek into Super Saiyan bad-asses. And they LOVED the finale JUST for that stupid fight.
Why do I keep bringing this up? Because Dragon Ball Z did the same thing on a regular basis, where tons of non-saiyan Z-warriors, despite their years of martial-arts training, all get victimized and murdered, just so that saiyans like Goku, Vegeta, and their sons could save the day on the account of them being saiyans. That problem would eventually pass on to Naruto and Bleach, whereby Naruto, Sasuke, and Ichigo become the only solutions to everything, while every one of their friends, despite their combat abilities, also get disposed of. One Piece, though, not so much, mostly because with few exceptions, the Straw Hat Pirates are almost always given something to do that prove their resourcefulness to Luffy, and as a result barely get victimized themselves.
But the problems that plagued DBZ, Naruto, and Bleach all had to pass on to MLP's own Season Four finale, just because Meghan McCarthy had to end the fourth season with as huge a bang as possible. As a result, she rendered the first five key episodes meaningless, at least up until the end, and almost destroyed everything that made My Little Pony such a household name in the first place, including the core friendship themes.
Testing,Belles toil,Inspiration,Vanilli. They added to the crew, Twi kingdom was a hell of a finish but it added no depth to her.
Besides anything that builds the players the better. The rest is fluff.
@Smithers If that's how you feel about the song, then it accomplished exactly what it was supposed to. If Spike's epic recovery in the climax didn't justify it in your eyes like the death and rebirth of a DC character...well, you can't please everyone.
Someone's a-trollin' this pollin'. "Breezies" just jumped up five places from where it was yesterday (which is where it's been almost since the start).
Stillz: Best Spike episode of all time? How about least watch-able Spike scene of all time?
I don't have any problem with a lack of sporting events, (In any case we saw enough of the only event we cared about to justify it ending the way we knew it would.)
But seriously, how does one answer "you've just volunteered to sing a song you know nothing about in front of a huge crowd" with "I'll just make something up about how they have nice trees (even though they live in the sky and trees grow on the ground)" instead of "run for the hills because that can't make it any worse right now"?
dashie24: As much as I loved "Testing," my first thought when RD was initially unfazed by the test was that she obviously already knew everything there was to know about them, I guess I never really managed to suspend my disbelief that she didn't. (Or maybe I'm just petty for the episode proving me wrong.)
Rockpath5: Imma let you finish, but the breezies are the one thing that G3 did better than G4. Somehow the spindly appearance never struck me as cute, whereas the G3 breezies where simply adorable, tiny (flying, antenna-bearing) ponies. (This, coming from someone who would have hated MLP prior to G4, but has watched the old episodes for historical interest and found them to be not all bad. [For reference G4 > G1 original series > G3 > G1 MLP tales. (Seriously, Tales is shit; skip it)])
Badly Drawn Turtle: "make sure that all of the characters, but with special focus on Pinkie, Spike, and Rarity, are in character." Surely out of everypony, Pinkie is the most likely to have her character turn in completely unexpected directions?
Oh and re. "a pattern, I tell you, a pattern?" If patterns were that infallible we'd have all been playing Pokémon grey not too long ago.
As for long comments, I'm only a fraction of the way up the list of comments I could respond too; things can only get worse (until I hit 4k chars).
EternalNothingness: "Up until the ending itself, the fight deliberately SACRIFICED and DISREGARDED the Mane Five's hard work and dedication toward earning their own keys, just so that Twilight could become a Super Saiyan bad-ass in the most pandering, superficial fashion imaginable." And what came of that fight? Complete stalemate and no more. What that fight sequence proved was that neither Twilight nor Tirek's Saiyan powers where useful for anything except looking bad-flank. In the end Twilight's willingness to give everything for her friends, including Discord, was her only meaningful action; that is what ultimately earned her her key and allowed the mane cast to save the day.
ilm126: Well, I can help you with part of that decision; don't bother with the premier because that poll has been and gone. This is the S4E14-26 poll! :-)
Actually, my comment RE the super-saiyan boss fight in E26 is one that would not have occurred to me without reading other comments on this poll, so thanks to those (especially EN) that inspired it. It is an important message (that I missed first time around) that what is by far the most serious fight between two characters we have seen in the whole series, had Twilight's insane magical abilities amount to sweet buck-all when it mattered. Individual physical or magical strength was shown to be ultimately irrelevant in the face of... [[all right, who's willing to do the title drop this time? Discord: Oh very well, I suppose I owe you]]
Discord: ...the Magic of Friendship!
[[Discord Happy now? Me: very]]
@EternalNothingness
The reason why Rainbow Falls was very low on the previous poll had nothing to do with the fans devaluing Rainbow. It's regarded by many to be the worst episode of Season 4. It had terrible writing, flanderization, and many pointless scenes that drag on way too long. Worse than Spike at Your Service, I dare say, for despite its one major flaw, I got more than a few chuckles out of it, especially the "Mary Sue fanfic" scene with Rarity and Rainbow. Fans don't devalue Rainbow. Not even Derpy could save the episode.The Breezy episode is heavily disliked for being overly toyetic and girly, even though it technically isn't even THAT toyetic; there are NO Mane 6 breezified toys as of yet, and I frequent stores every so often. That episode gets too much hate. Other episodes that don't receive a fraction of hatred are more toyetic than Fluttershy's key episode. As for Leap of Faith, people tend to devalue Applejack episodes for being rather safe. The episodes tend to lack memorable tidbits of humor, which is why they are easily forgotten. It had nothing to do with people wanting to see Applejack suffer for the prize of seeing super-powered Twilight fight. It wasn't that Twilight CHOSE alicorn magic over her friends. She was GIVEN the power by the other princesses. Thus, I don't think her friends were devalued. The Mane 6 weren't captured so that Twilight would gain all of the magic. She HAD the magic even before they were kidnapped.
What's wrong with the power gap? The power wasn't even hers to begin with. As I mentioned below, giving Twilight all of the alicorn magic was the safest option available at the time. A triple alicorn attack would have been WAY riskier. Twilight's "power" in the episode was circumstantial. On her own, she's a "higher than above average" unicorn in terms of magical prowess. A progidy, but far from being the all-power being among her friends that you implied she was. She didn't even know her friends were captured in the first place, so she didn't purposefully sacrifice and victimized them to gain the alicorn magic. "Twilight herself became the ultimate solution to everything on the account of her being an alicorn herself." Not exactly. If this was true, Celestia, Luna, or even Cadence could have saved the day themselves. Twilight was most likely chosen for her connection to the Element of Magic and/or her natural talent for magic. As I said earlier, Celestia could have been the only other recipient of the magic due to her connection to said element. Yet, she couldn't because the connection no longer works. (Also, Luna never had a connection with the Element of Magic, and sun power > moon, so she couldn't have done it.)
I get it. I get annoyed when people love an episode JUST for one scene. It's pretty fickle. Every episode has at least SOMETHING to offer, but when an underrated episode gets a pass because another episode has an epic moment, it's pretty sad.
I voted for Twilights kingdom part 2, best episode IMO. :)
Very well, then. You can't picture Spike being anything but awkward, I can easily see him fitting in (perhaps even having an equally meaningful scene with Maud if time constraints could be adjusted without sacrificing anything). Let's agree to disagree.
@Appletini I know! Isn't that annoying?
Again, the Mane Five had to work for their keys, where they had to resolve conflicts based on their Elements of Harmony and teach somepony else about their Elements. And, despite all that hard work and effort, the biggest thanks they got from Meghan McCarthy, at least up until the ending, was having their magic sucked dry by a giant, parasitic centaur from an old 1980's MLP movie. To add more salt to the wound, Twilight had to absorb three other alicorn princesses' magic, and then fight Tirek in a battle that did nothing else other than demonstrate a HEAVY power gap between Twilight and her friends.
And people LOVED it. They'd spit on some of the key episodes, and not bother with the Rainbow Power and Rainbow Castle. But when it comes to that big, bloated fight and that power imbalance between Twilight and all of her friends, they're okay with it, even though they were never okay with the same thing happening in DBZ, as well as Naruto and Bleach.
It seems as if a large number of people blindly vote for season finales (Except for the only good one, The Best Night Ever).
I went with Testing, Testing, 1, 2, 3 since I can't vote for Twilight's Kingdom as a whole. Part 2 is nothing without part 1
Gah! This poll IS the hardest one to vote on!
There are the season premiere and the finale to consider, the fan loved ones as well, plus my personal favourite "Testing, Testing, 1, 2, 3". Gah! A really hard choice here...
@Badly Drawn Turtle Well, here's the thing. I don't want to be a part of the majority, who loved Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 for its bloated fight scene, but dislike other key episodes like Rainbow Falls, Breezies, and Leap of Faith. In my opinion, Twilight's Kingdom was the WORST of the key episodes, because it casually discarded the Mane Five and disregarded their contributions to the season-long story-arc, just to turn Twilight into the stupidest, most pandering Super Saiyan bad-ass in the universe. I mean, say what you will about three of the other key episodes, plus Rarity Takes Manehattan and Pinkie Pride, at least all five of them gave the Mane Five meaningful character-development, right up until they were victimized and disposed of for the sake of turning Twilight into a big, bloated bad-ass.
@EternalNothingness
Please stop. You're giving me a headache trying to follow your (oddly Dragonball-themed) argument. You're also being highly aggressive to anyone who replies to you. That isn't good.
@Stillz "...when was the last time Spike's presence needed to be explained to anyone?"
Okay, I admit that was a bit of a stretch. I stand by everything else I've said, however.*
"...but you make the mistake of applying the characteristics of our social groups to a fairy tale universe in which those psychological barriers are much more lenient."
No, actually. I make the reasonable assumption of applying the characteristics of our social groups to a fairy tale universe written by humans in which the psychological barriers are generally shown to be just as strong. You're looking at the show through rose-colored glasses; the pony society isn't nearly as nice as some people make it out to be.
"Everything in your second paragraph goes against the show's messages of friendship and harmony;"
I'm sorry if what I'm describing goes against the show's message. What I'm describing is the situation in the show, so the show must not be following the message as well as you thought. Spike's situation is unusual, and it needs resolution eventually (hopefully there'll be a Spike sub-arc this coming season the way there's a CMC sub-arc of sorts), but a non-Spike episode like "Maud Pie" is not where it should start.
"...what's so harmonious about a dragon having no place among the characters who provide the bulk of his social interaction? How can one be “shoehorned” into their own family?"
The thing is, I'm not arguing from harmony, I'm arguing from the evidence provided in the show, as well as the writers' view of the makeup of an episode. I never said anything about Spike being "shoehorned" into the group, I said; "Shoehorning him in to an episode where he isn't necessary isn't giving him his due, it's... shoehorning him in where he isn't necessary.". Notice that I said "episode", not "group" or "family"? Yeah, that was a significant part of that sentence's meaning. I also said "where he isn't necessary", which is a situation-specific description, and quite different from "no place among the characters...", which is an absolute and much stronger a statement then I made.
And then you say I don't have imagination, or am being biased. A, my imagination is perfectly fine, thank you. B, how exactly could I be biased, here? I'm not emotionally invested in Spike being in the episode or not in the episode. Bias comes from emotional investment, so it's unlikely I'm biased. I thought about it again... and all I can picture is "awkward Spike", where he stands around being the butt of a visual pun or two, and doing nothing of import. That is the worst type of Spike, and bad writing to boot. You don't add in a character if they don't contribute to the story; which is what I keep saying, while it seems you keep hearing something else.
*"Don't patronize people who disagree with you by pretending you're right and they're wrong."
The last two paragraphs of my previous comment were uncalled for. I'm sorry for that. I know excuses are bad, but I've had a bad week, so my filter isn't as strong as it usually is.
@Adam Burt Why? Because it demonstrated a heavy power gap between Twilight and her friends? Did you WANT the Mane Five to be discarded and even murdered, so that Twilight could become the ultimate solution to everything for the rest of the series, a la every saiyan and non-saiyan in DBZ?
And what about the five key episodes? The Mane Five worked very hard to earn their keys, and you're devaluing and discarding their individual-yet-combined efforts just to make way for Twilight's stupid Super Saiyan bad-assery? Do you WANT the show to give up on its own friendship themes to become Dragon Ball Z from now on until the end of the series?
I like how there is no contest. :>
@Shadow Rose Look, it's just that Breezies and Leap of Faith have the least amount of votes right now, while Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 is earning the most votes out of all the episodes mostly because of that fight scene. That meant that, in some shape or form, you're devaluing not only Fluttershy and Applejack, but also in some regard Rarity, Pinkie Pie, and Rainbow Dash, most especially since in the last poll, Rainbow Falls also received very few votes.
I DO want to believe that the Mane Five did play their parts in their own key episodes, and as a result believe that it was enough to compensate for their victimization and disposability in Twilight's Kingdom. But not when tons of people are liking the the finale for its stupid fight and the way it demonstrated a heavy power gap between Twilight and her friends.
Besides, the reason I'd say something like that is because MLP's battle was akin to DBZ, but what's ALSO akin to DBZ was the victimization and disposability of the hero's friends, exchanged for the hero's over-empowerment. In DBZ, every non-saiyan Z-Warrior was going to die or get benched on the account of being non-saiyans, and the only ones who were always going to save the day were the saiyans, like Goku and Vegeta. Likewise, Twilight's friends were singled out on the account of not being alicorns, while Twilight herself became the ultimate solution to everything on the account of her being an alicorn herself.
Testing is different from Maud because the former was work-related and the latter was recreational. And honestly, when was the last time Spike's presence needed to be explained to anyone? Never. Shave off some of your imaginary run time.
The rest of your logic is sound, but you make the mistake of applying the characteristics of our social groups to a fairy tale universe in which those psychological barriers are much more lenient. Everything in your second paragraph goes against the show's messages of friendship and harmony; what's so harmonious about a dragon having no place among the characters who provide the bulk of his social interaction? How can one be “shoehorned” into their own family?
It is very possible I'm wrong, but so far the only excuse I can fathom is your disturbingly clinical, “he doesn't fit the demographic, and would therefore get in the way no matter how small his participation”. It's extremely easy to picture him fitting smoothly into the episode...without taking up more time than what's already there, even! The fact that you cannot suggests a serious lack of (or just biased) imagination, and a lack of faith in the writers to craft a streamlined narrative.
Don't patronize people who disagree with you by pretending you're right and they're wrong. I may have an unpopular opinion, but yours is no more or less valid.
This poll was tough, but I ended up picking Testing, Testing 1,2,3. It was a very relatable episode for me, and even more so when coming from my favorite pony.
Twilight's Kingdom was a close second with all its epicness, but I felt SO bad for the Mane 5 in that episode.
Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 for me, love the fighting sence.
@EternalNothingness. Just wow. Your whole premise is so completely around the bend that I'm just not interested taking the ride. Sorry
@Stillz "You won't hear me complaining about “Testing, Testing...” because he didn't have a job there, so his inclusion would've been pointless."
... You have yet to explain how "Maud Pie" is different. Spike's inclusion would, again, be pointless. It would not be "better" to give him a five second cameo just so that he exists. He would be an unusual element; a talking point (look, a dragon!) that would have to be explained to Maud, taking up episode time. He has few clear interests to share with Maud (an oversight they will eventually correct, I hope), and would contribute absolutely nothing to the episode that wasn't already there.
And, despite what you seem to think, Spike is not one of the Main Six. He is one of the ten main characters, but the Main Six have a special dynamic that Spike isn't a part of. He doesn't wield an element, he doesn't have to navigate life as a relatively young adult, and he isn't a mare. To say that not including him is a slight against him is to forget that it's just as bad for his character when he's around and not relevant. Again, this episode was about Maud and Pinkie, along with Pinkie's closest friends. Spike may be a friend, but he isn't a mare, he isn't an adult, and ultimately, he isn't as close to the others as he is to Twilight; Pinkie wouldn't think of him as a "best friend". If that makes you sad, I'm sorry, but it's the truth. Spike is the sidekick, as "Power Ponies" highlights. He's the youngling, and the token boy. There is no avoiding that he is different, and different can take attention from the plot of another character's story. Shoehorning him in to an episode where he isn't necessary isn't giving him his due, it's... shoehorning him in where he isn't necessary. It's bad writing, and the people working on the show are all the better for realizing when he isn't needed in a particular episode.
That's not to say I don't like Spike; he's a great character (when written well, at least - like in the first Equestria Girls). But I like Pinkie, too, and I don't complain when she isn't present. A like Fluttershy, but she doesn't have to be there all the time. If you honestly lose faith in the fandom when someone explains how writing and stories work, and defends the decisions of the writers; then I'm sorry for you. Sorry, not just because you aren't fully enjoying what the fandom has to offer, but because this attitude could lead to serious problems later in life. If you can't tolerate people with different opinions, then I have some news: you will never find anyone who agrees with you on every single thing. You'll be alone.
I guess I'll end with a suggestion: Take a step back; consider all that I've said, and if you don't like me for it, then don't like me. But remember it all the same; another refrain for that little voice in the back of your head who's job it is to tell you when you might be wrong.
@EternalNothingness
How was the Mane 5's hard work towards earning their keys diminished by the sacrifice? Twilight knew what was at stake. The fight was intense not just because of the action, but because of what the audience knows that the Mane 6 has been through in Season 4. Everyone worked hard to remain true to their element and teach lessons to others, even if they weren't initially aware of it ;the Tirek battle/magic sacrifice was the last step for Twilight to realize that Friendship IS magic to attain the key. Twilight was the main solution because she is the current bearer of the Element of Magic. All three princesses thought as much. She was chosen to carry the power of the other princesses because she could withstand it. Celestia is presumably the strongest of the three, considering the moon's illumination is caused by the sun's reflection, yet probably couldn't withstand holding the magic because of probably two reasons. One, 'magic' isn't her forte; her magic is related to the sun, not 'magic' in general. Two, Celestia was no longer bound to the Element of Magic, meaning she literally could not handle all of the magic, which makes sense if we assume that Twilight's 'magic' cutie mark doesn't factor into this. At one point, she probably could carry all of that magic because she WAS the bearer of the Element of Magic. I didn't think she was chosen because she happened to be an alicorn among her friends. In case you wanted to say that letting the three princess keep their power to rush Tirek was a plausible idea, it really wasn't. If Tirek got a lucky shot out of just one of the princesses, even Cadence, he could easily overpower them, considering he already consumed much of Equestria's magic. Twilight would have absolutely no bargaining chip for her friends, who would promptly be killed with complete disregard since he'd already have all of the magic. There'd also be no chance for Discord to realize his mistake and ask for forgiveness; in short, there would be NO lesson taught, NO 6th key obtained, and an unopened box. Also, Twilight didn't dispose of her friends. Tirek did. He sucked their magic and used them as bargaining chips, yet didn't care about them. Twilight was the one who treasured their safety more than the possession of the great magic she had that was insufficient to win the fight.
Frankly, NOBODY would want to see the Mane 6 murdered just for the sake for some action. Where did you get that idea?
@Medicine Cat "Wow?" That is all you will say, right? Nothing more specific than that?
@EternalNothingness Wow.
@Medicine Cat Here's the thing. Unlike other shows of its era, like Power Rangers and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, DBZ did not promote friendship and teamwork. When Akira Toriyama revealed Goku as a saiyan, and established that only saiyans can increase their power levels infinitely through their Super Saiyan forms, he wrote himself into a corner on what kind of stories he could write, as well as promoted unhealthy messages like natural selection and genetic destiny. And I HATED DBZ for what it unintentionally promoted.
That was the Twilight/Tirek fight in a nutshell: Dispose of the hero's friends and reduce them to helpless extras, while the main-protagonist becomes the ultimate solution to everything on the account of her being an alicorn compared to her friends. Up until the ending itself, the fight deliberately SACRIFICED and DISREGARDED the Mane Five's hard work and dedication toward earning their own keys, just so that Twilight could become a Super Saiyan bad-ass in the most pandering, superficial fashion imaginable.
And yet, you liked that finale more than the other five key episodes. You'd DISREGARD the Mane Five for the sake of seeing Twilight become a Super Saiyan bad-ass. You probably even want them MURDERED to show off more of Twilight's bad-assery!
@EternalNothingness I would hazard a guess that it was popular with MLP fans because it was a terrific MLP episode. I'd further venture a guess that you didn't like it primarily because it wasn't a Dragonball episode.
Why the Hell would Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 receive the most votes out of all the episodes? It victimized and disposed of the Mane Five, after having their own individual key episodes, just as a lazy excuse to demonstrate how much of an overpowered monster Tirek is, and so that they could also demonstrate how much of a Super Saiyan bad-ass Twilight was.
If anything, I get the feeling that people LOVED the way Twilight's friends were disempowered and victimized, and WANTED them to be sidelined and murdered so that Twilight could become Super Saiyan Goku. This is most especially true when you look at the five key episodes, which developed mixed receptions galore, as well as the Rainbow Power and Rainbow Castle, neither of which were well-received themselves despite giving Twilight's friends relevancy to the season-long story-arc. This adds even more evidence to the fact that people want Twilight's friends to get murdered for the sake of empowering Twilight, just because the same happened in DBZ, where every non-saiyan was sidelined or murdered, just so that the saiyans like Goku and Vegeta could save the day like the overpowered Mary Sues that they are.
Voted for Maud Pie. Unlike the majority, based on previous poll results, I didn't vote on an episode JUST for one awesome moment it may have had. I'm somewhat surprised that Leap of Faith isn't a bit higher because "OMG LYRA." Sure, Maud demolished those rocks and used a rock-nuke, but that wasn't why I voted for Maud Pie. It was genuinely interesting to see a character so vastly different from the cheery norm we see in Ponyville interact with the Mane 6. I don't mind Spike's exclusion. He wasn't necessary. Yes, I'm a bit biased since I don't care for him to much, but I still think it would be TOO much to include him in. I don't hate him personally; his episodes aren't usually good and his character doesn't seem dynamic enough to convince me that I should care about him. I do feel bad when he's used for physical humor though. It's almost as though the writers has no place for Spike. As though Ponyville has no place for Spike. If Maud was introduced too soon or if Spike was forced to talk to her in a 5-second scene, it would feel forced and unnatural. Plus, if we had to cut things out, we might have had to cut awesomely entertaining scenes such as Maud's Engaging Poetry.
Episodes should only include characters necessary for the plot and who will produce worthwhile interactions. (Despite this, Daring Don't ROCKED. Why do so many people dislike that episode?) Maud Pie was a great piece of work. No doubt about it, of quartz.
@Badly Drawn Turtle You're 100% right; not every character needs to be in every episode. Half the mane six didn't need to be in “Testing, Testing...”, and four out of the six didn't need to be in “Daring Don't”. I'm pretty sure you're intentionally putting the worst possible spin on my words to support your straw man argument. What I'm saying is: it's only when all six ponies are slotted in, and Spike needlessly cut, that my enjoyment is dashed. You won't hear me complaining about “Testing, Testing...” because he didn't have a job there, so his inclusion would've been pointless.
I'm no writer, so I can't rightly say what he could have contributed to “Maud Pie”. And we'll probably never have answers to questions like that since the writers would apparently rather sterilize their imaginations than put them to the task of finding a place for him among the group (regardless of what friends he has outside the six, they're still his closest, so it's baffling that he wasn't as much a priority when meeting Pinkie's sister). But that _doesn't_ mean you get to proclaim there's nothing he could have possibly added. Here's my idea: Spike could've met Maud, offered her tea, exchanged one or two awkward glances with Twilight, and joined the gang at the Pie farm. That's it. The episode's narrative dynamic is not interfered with, and it is improved by acknowledging that he's part of their goddamn lives.
“Maud Pie” is an episode that I will never feel good about, and the more people tell me to stop hating something that genuinely drags down my high spirits while trying to justify an orphan character's lack of involvement with his surrogate family, the less I'll like this fandom as well.
@smotly If Scootaloo or Sweetie had been missing from “Babs Seed” (the equivalent of what happened to Spike – whose situation is quite different – in “Maud”), then maybe you'd have reason to throw your tantrum. The CMC aren't an inseparable unit like the mane six appear to be.
@Stillz Oh, I'm sorry. Your definition of fun is "obviously Spike needs to be in every episode, and when the writers don't include him, it must be a purposeful slight against his character." I've got news for you; not every character needs to be in every episode. In fact, that was one of the main legitimate complaints about Season 4: the writers tried to stuff all of the main cast into the episode too often. If there are too many characters, then less time is spent on any one character or the interaction of any two, and the plot (generally focused on only one or two characters primarily) suffers. Ask yourself not were Spike is, but what, exactly, he would have added to an episode like "Maud Pie". If he wouldn't have anything interesting to contribute to an interaction with Maud, then including him would have been a strain on the already short time frame of an episode. If he would have contributed something unique, then all the worse, because this episode is supposed to be focused on Pinkie and Maud, not Spike. The last thing a writer wants is to have a secondary character steal the spotlight from the intended focus. (Don't get the wrong idea, here. By "secondary character", I mean one who's around, but not the main focus of the episode. Twilight, Fluttershy, RD, Rarity and AJ were all secondary characters in this episode.)
@smotly There's also the simple fact that that not everyone is around all the time. It would get ridiculous if Spike never left Twilight's side to do his own thing (I imagine he must have some friends outside the main six, he isn't asocial, and has separate interests of his own like they all do), or if the Crusaders were literally always shown together (again, separate interests, separate lives). Why, for instance, would Scootaloo be hanging around during the Sisterhooves Social when she didn't have a sister until Season 3? It would be awkward, unnecessary, and bad writing for shoving in an extra character just because. (Extra, as in not useful to the story being told.)
Please, everyone, stop hating on episodes just because they don't include some character or other. If all of the characters were around all of the time, the writers would be significantly constrained in what they could write about; both to include everypony (and dragon) and to make a story heard over the din of excessive character interactions. PIck an episode like "Pinkie Apple Pie" and shove just one more character into it. No matter who you pick (Flutters, Rarity, Scootaloo, Bonbon) it ruins the dynamic of the episode. There is simply no room for another character in the story. This is less obvious, but still true, for most episodes. The writers aren't attacking any characters; they're trying to tell a good tale.
There's always that one (or two) episode(s) that always dominate these polls. Jeebus.
Possibly the hardest set of episodes to choose from, a lot of fun and memorable episodes here.
Shame they're overshadowed by the fight with Tirek for so many people though.
@Stillz I know what you mean.I have the sam issue with Scootaloo,whenever AB and SB appears without her(Inspiration Manisfestation,Sisterhooves Social,few other)my blood starts to boil...Same goes with Spike,he is one of the most important characters in the show(Twilight's first REAL friend-i'm not counting Shining Armor)and he is treated poorly.
I voted for Leap of Faith-Big Mac Sharknado,Flim and Flam being smart,and pretty good lesson+plus i liked the song.
I'm not suprised by the order of the Episodes,maybe except Leap of Faith(AJ deserves more!)
I voted for Maud Pie.
Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 might have that awesome Fightscene, but for me it became less impressive, because Twilight wasn't fighting with her own Power, that she have trained since she could use Magic, but with the Power just given to her
Maud on the other Hand was able to throw a Rock way harder than Rainbow (without even trying) and saved her Sister from Boulder. Both are Scenes, where she was using the Strenght she was building up for working on a Rockfarm, not some random Power she got just before.
Also I'm glad that Simple Ways got last Place in this Poll, since it's my most hated Episode. The Swapped Roles-Segment might have been Funny under other Circumstances, but what killed that Episode for me is the Fact that my favorite Pony was turned into a stereotypical High School-Girl with a Crush on some random new Guy (even with a Stalker-Shrine). Even Blueblood was better, since he was introduced in a Phantasy-Segment in the 3rd Episode (where we still have to learn about the Mane 6) and was really introduced in the Season 1 Finale... And there Rarity didn't act like an Idiot
@Badly Drawn Turtle You're failing to interpret much of what I typed and jumping to conclusions. Sheesh, I'm not saying, "Nobody like MY favorite episode!? You suck!" I'm annoyed that an episode that went to obscene lengths to cut him from the main cast's social circle is getting so much more approval. That goes against what the show is about to me: friendship, equality, inclusion, diversity, etc. Every time I see the mane six without Spike, my optimism take a blow.
"Testing, Testing" bar none. That episode flowed like butter. It's the best episode of the whole show as far as character interaction, world building, and plot goes.
I'm okay with the second half of "Twilight's Kingdom" getting first, but can "Testing, Testing, 1, 2, 3" get second? It totally deserves it.
Plus, Pinkie's "Rapin' History of the Wonderbolts".
Of course Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 is going to win. It was the most bold, epic, and daring (as far as controversial content goes; coming only second overall to The Last Roundup) episode of the season!
I haven't seen Twilight's Kingdom, Equestria Games and the last Rarity episode (suddenly I lost interest in the show by the times those episodes aired), but my favorite of this bunch, and from the season four, was Filli Vanilli.
@Stillz If your definition of fun is "Everyone agrees with my choice of favorite episode", then it would be pretty hard to have fun in any fandom, or in life in general.
This choice was agony only comparable to second Season 2 poll. There aren't any episodes I didn't like, and only two that I could even say are low on my list. It came down to a choice between:
"Filli Vanilli" with the fantastic song woven throughout the episode (Yes, good enough that I can ignore Pinkie being completely out of character (Seriously, though; it was Pinkie Pie way back in Season 1 who told Dash that Fluttershy was too sensitive to prank. There should be someone who's job it is to go through each script as they're written and make sure that all of the characters, but with special focus on Pinkie, Spike, and Rarity, are in character.).);
"It Ain't Easy Being Breezies" because Breezies and the lesson of being cruel to be kind;
"Leap of Faith" because it reflected so very well a real world scenario (Scam artists still do the same thing that the Flim Flam Brothers did in this episode. Yes, real people fall for it by the hundreds. It often takes the form of "faith healing", which makes people even more gullible by adding supposed religious support to the tricksters' words. You can also compare it to the current scourge of "alternative medicine", which as a general rule claims something ridiculous and then falls back on the arguments of the Flim Flam Brothers if someone challenges them.) and how lying to make someone feel better ultimately does more harm than good;
"Testing Testing 1, 2, 3" because it was full of adorable Rainbow Dash/Twilight interactions;
and "Twilight's Kingdom Part 1" for the multi-princess song and the highlighting of both Twilight's and Discord's doubts about their current positions.
Ultimately though, the winner for me, hooves down, has to be "For Whom the Sweetie Belle Toils". No, random Luna-hater, it wasn't "because Luna". It was because Luna, and Sweetie, and Rarity mixing together to tell possibly the deepest and most heart-piercing tale in the series so far. It had everything; world-building, continuity-nods that were important to the plot, mentor having a real connection with student's plight, the Mistake Made in Rage, the Toil for Redemption, dream sequences, and the all-around feel; looking back, it's hard to understand how it was a choice for me at all.
...Now, with this one and Scootaloo's "Sleepless in Ponyville", we can only hope that Apple Bloom's Luna visit is just as epic. (Of course it will happen; it's a pattern, I tell you, a pattern!)
Yes, this was a long comment. I have no regrets. Not for this comment, at least. I have plenty of other regrets, though...
This is the toughest poll ever! lol
I'm gonna have to go with Equestria Games because it was not only my favorite Spike episode, but one of my all-time favorites too! :D
I voted for Twilight's Kingdom Part 2 but now that I see the results I wish I had voted for Leap of Faith. It's a great episode and it's gotten too few votes.
It Ain't Easy Being Breezies was one of the best episodes of all time.
@Abraman Which is fine, except for the margin by which Spike's most spectacular episode is being overwhelmed by an episode that pretended he didn't exist. It's the most disheartening thing I've seen all week (and I was having a pretty good week after one of the best artists around resurfaced as DfectiveDvice). Reminds me why it's next to impossible to have any fun in this fandom when other fans are involved.
Every Applejack fan should give a vote of appreciation to the amazing "Leap of Faith" - the best Applejack episode since "Applebuck Season" in S1. It's currently polling WAY too low.
@Stillz really it's more like people had other favorite episodes than EG.
OH WHAT A SURPRISE
Voted for "Testing, Testing, 1, 2, 3..." which was my favorite episode in Season 4, possibly the whole series. It was funny and heartwarming, and now Dashie is in the Wonderbolt Reserves! :)
I can see why “Somepony to Watch Over Me” only has 2 votes. Why the hell is Sonneborn coming back?! But yeah, Boulder FTW!
Oh yes, and it's being crazy dominated by Maud Pie, the episode that treated Spike like absolutely nothing. Sometimes I really do hate this fandom's tastes.
Equestria Games, the best Spike episode of all time, only has a shred of votes. Are people STILL bitching and whining about how it didn't focus on any sporting events!?
I KNEW that "Twilight's Kingdom 2" was gonna be top and "Maud Pie" 2nd. :P
"Testing, Testing" for moi.